Jeremy: Good evening and welcome to
Progressively Horrified the podcast

or where we hold order to progressive
standards it never agreed to.

Our selection tonight is an innovative
2022 horror drama fusion that is light

on the palette with faint notes of
class warfare and fine dining satire.

It's the menu.

I am your host Jeremy Whitley.

And with me tonight I have a
panel of cinephiles Encino bytes.

First, today we're here to challenge
the sexy werewolf, sexy vampire binary.

My co-host Ben Kahn.

Ben Howie Tonight

Ben: My review a movie that'll make
you go, I'll have what she's having.

Jeremy: Absolutely.

Ben: That's a hairy Meet Sally
reference for all you kids who did

not see Billy Crystal Boomer romcoms.

Jeremy: And kids co go
watch when Harry met Sally.

It's good actually.

Ben: Yeah.

Jeremy: And our guest tonight, 20 year
restaurant veteran certified Sommelier

and wine podcast here, Andy Reid.

Andy, great to have you.

Andi: Hello.

I'm so happy to be here.

Jeremy: This is an exciting one to talk to
you about because I, I have no experience

in the fine dining world, but uh, I, I
recognize artsy bullshit when I see it.

Ben: and I am very excited for
this because Andy and I have known

each other since we were about 18.

Is that about right?

Andi: Les though.

I think well, okay, maybe 17.

Ben: Yeah.

I think about 17 and we are now not 17.

Andi: Shut up.

Shut up.

We're 17 forever, except I can drink
now, which makes it permissible.

Ben: As opposed to when you
were drinking when you were 17.

Andi: Yeah, obviously

Jeremy: Well, yeah.

This one is um, this one is a fun one.

It's directed by Mark Mylod, and it's
written by Seth Reiss and Will Tracy.

It's Stars Ralph Fiennes Anya
Taylor-Joy, Nicholas Hoult, Hong

Chau, John Leguizamo, and whole
variety of other like great actors.

It's, it's really like a murderers row.

Uh, And Judith Light is here.

Judith Light's always.

Ben: Oh yeah we got modern horror icon
on you, Taylor-Joy, budding horror

icon and really Hollywood's next great
weirdo little guy, Nicholas Hoult

Jeremy: so, yeah, a good,
good assortment of people.

Ben, you uh, got the recap on this one.

So,

Ben: Oh, hell yeah, I do.

Oh my God.

Fucking let me tell you about the menu.

Our cinematic adventure through
the culinary world opens on

weirdo foodie Tyler and his date
with biggest fucking air quotes.

You can imagine Margot traveling by boat
to the Hawthorne, the fanciest fucking

Michelin Sno, snooty tuty restaurant.

You can imagine it's a secluded
island cuz haha, fuck you.

Poor people you don't even get to see.

This restaurant.

Also on the boat are a collection
of soon to be killed, unlike people

including a judgey food critic and her
simpering editor, a trio of business

pros and John Leguizamo as himself.

Question mark.

The group's there to eat the cooking of
Julian Slowik who as Tyler as quick to

remind us is apparently just the bees mes.

When the mam Elsa greets them, she's
suspiciously upset that Margo is not

the guest Tyler said would be coming.

They all get to tour the island
and we get fancy food, meaning talk

and foreshadowing for important
locations later in the movie.

It's a twofer after that.

Hold on to your butts for the most
stressful meal you've ever had that

didn't involve your racist uncle.

Slowik comes out and before each
course delivers just the most

fucking unnerving monologues.

Real, I'm about to kill all you vibes.

Then on the third course, they all get
the tortillas of shame showing their

secrets and indiscretions also hung
chaus is the phrase tortillas deliciosas.

It's real fun for the
fourth course suicide.

This one chef is just so sad and wants
to be a better chef, but also doesn't,

and then he just puts a gun in his mouth
and everyone's freaking out except Tyler.

Cuz Tyler's a weird little fucking
food freak who's way too chill.

The super rich regular guest tries
to leave but slow is like, nah.

And they cut off his finger.

The business bros are
like, you can't do this.

We work for your owner and
Slowik says, you may this owner.

And then he just straight
up drowns a motherfucker.

Well, they all watch

Jeremy: He drowns his angel
investor by putting him in wings and

lowering him into the water cause
he's got a sense of humor, Slowik

Ben: this movie.

Fucking rules.

I love the menu.

If you couldn't tell course five.

Slow off a me too scandal by letting the
chef he arrest, stab him, cancel culture.

Am I right?

I'm not.

Anyway, the men are given his
chance to escape the island.

They all fail.

The women eat alone and with the
chef Catherine, and they try to

convince her to, you know, not
murder them and herself, but twist.

She's girl bossing, murder, suicide.

So the food critics just
drinks all the wine.

It's not blunt, relevant that she
chugs the wine, but it is relatable.

Uh, once all the men are brought back
to the restaurant, Slowik says they're

each there because they helped him
lose his passion for cooking or start

in the Super Mario Brothers movie.

Margot's not supposed to be there, though.

So Slowik privately confronts her
and gives her the choice of dying

with them or dying with the guests.

Margot understandably is
like, that's a bad choice.

And Slowik is like, fuck
you, I'm Ralph Fiennes.

Then we get Margot's backstory on how
she's an escort and Slowik reveals

that Tyler knew mumps in advance that
he and anyone he brought with him

would be killed cuz Tyler so fucking
little fucked up, little weirdo.

Fuck Margo wants to kill him
right there, but slow Lake's

like, nah, that's too good.

Slow makes Tyler feel like a big
special boy by giving him his own

chef jacket, but then forces him to
suddenly cook in front of everyone.

And he does such a Bad job that
Slowik tells him to kill himself.

And he does this movie all fucking wild.

Slow has Margot get a barrel
of dessert from the smokehouse.

And Elsa gets a real hey jealousy
and thinks that she's being replaced

by Margot, so she tries to kill her
and it does not go well for Elsa.

Margot then finds slow it's
bedroom and how it used to

be a happy young burger cook.

She radios for help, but Long Coast
Guard man is also working for slow wic.

As the chef gets ready for Jeff
smores, Margot says the food was

bullshit and she's still hungry.

She wants a cheeseburger.

And after the scene of Slowik
cooking one, you will too.

In return for giving him back
his love of cooking Slowik let's

Margot and only Margot live.

The rest death, and I don't care what
fucking Slowik says, s'mores are god

damn delicious, fucking love s'mores.

Anyway, Margot eats everyone's
else's dead, and I absolutely

fucking adore this movie.

And.

Andi: Yeah,

Jeremy: Yeah, this was
my first time seeing it.

I loved this movie a lot.

I think some, standouts to me were the
fact that he uh, specifically murders

John Leguizamo's character who is
build as movie star um, in the film.

Because he spent his one day off, which
is a Sunday, his one day off in a month

uh, going to see one of his films and
it was bad , so he deserves to die.

And his um, assistant slash girlfriend
slash something else is like, well,

surely like, you're not gonna kill me.

And he is like, where
did you go to school?

He says, brown.

And he says, you have any student loans?

And she says, no.

He's like, yeah, you're gonna die

Ben: That was incredible.

Like this movie is funny.

Like this movie is clued into
exactly what it sense of humor

is, and that's one of the absolute
standouts is the student loans.

No, you're gonna die.

Oh man.

And that was especially because they'd
really set up John Leguizamo to die

for food related sins, like just a lack
of respect, wanting to just do like a

cheap bullshit food travel show, just
like devaluing the real craft of it.

And it's so funny that it's
just because he watched a shitty

movie of his on his one day off.

Andi: I mean, having, been in
that situation before, you know,

if you're working a job that has
you working 14 hour days, six days

a week, and you do only get like
that one day off, when you watch a

bullshit movie, you do feel cheated.

I have felt that rage before

.
It's, uh,

yeah, yeah.

Sex and the City is dead to me now.

So

yeah.

Ben: I feel like if you willingly put on
sex in the city too, you have it coming.

What happened next?

Andi: I mean, yeah, I, probably did, but.

I was sad.

Okay,

Ben: Watch your fucking
back, Carrie Bradshaw.

Andy's coming for you.

Jeremy: also it seems like to
some extent, an element in that

discussion with John Leguizamo's
character about like, , artistry.

Like they're both artists in their
own craft who, you know, loved what

they were doing and at some point
have just started like doing bullshit.

Like they're, they're not
really doing what they love.

And he's in the same boat.

He, He says at one point when the business
bros are asking him uh, what he's working

on now, he's like, oh, I'm sort of in the
presenter phase of my career, which is the

funniest shit I've ever heard anybody say.

Ben: That's like real
like, ah, you know what?

I'm like dancing with the Stars era.

Jeremy: You know, I'm trying
to find my inner sea crest.

Ben: I have to talk about what,
to me, more than anything else

that happened in this movie.

broke.

My suspension of disbelief and
momentarily took me out of the

movie, and that's Ralph Fiennes.

Supposed to be from the American Midwest.

Fucking

Andi: Yeah.

Ben: Nebraskan.

Ralph Fiennes fucking broke me.

Jeremy: I mean, you figure he's a chef
for a ridiculous Michelin star restaurant.

He probably speaks with
a fake British accent.

Andi: Yeah.

I mean there's, there's definitely people
in the industry who, I mean, so we spend

so much of our time serving these people
that are from these upper classes and

we're just so desperate to kind of.

Make our own mark that there are a lot
of people that I've worked with that

put on affectations and wholly different
personalities when they're at work and

then you see them like three hours af
off the clock in a dive bar and they're

just, their actions completely different.

Their demeanors completely different.

so I can kind of see like a
Nebraska boy f a British accent.

Would I believe it was Ralph Fiennes?

No, but that's just

Ben: Yeah, it.

Just fucking Shakespearean actor
trained Ralph Fiennes not even

attempting to do an American accent.

Andi: it would be like Ian Mcklellan
saying, yes, I came from Wisconsin.

Ben: Yeah.

I'm like, it took me back a little.

Jeremy: There's a lot of calling out
of very specific locations in this

movie, and I, I was never sure exactly
what was up with that, but like they're

very specific about what hounds in
different states people are from.

There's a lot of like, Just

Ben: they're also very Yeah.

Names.

Yeah.

They're like, oh no.

They're very specific about
what names someone should have.

Like, you're not a Margot.

I've met Margot's.

You're not Margot.

Which ends up being
completely accurate also.

Yes.

I also believe that Anya
Taylor-Joy is from Boston.

This is also believable.

I refuse to believe Anya Taylor-Joy
has ever lived in a place that didn't

have its own built-in horse stable.

Jeremy: So who is um, for you guys who
is the worst character in this ensemble?

Ben: Tyler,

Andi: Oh,

Ben: I mean, just pure moral reprehensible

Jeremy: Yeah.

Ben: because it's Tyler, but Tyler
was also the most fun character.

Like Tyler was the most
entertaining fucking weirdo.

Like Nicholas Hal did such a
good job with this character.

Andi: Yeah, no.

I, I don't know, like, yes Tyler
is insufferable, but I think

the worst character might be.

of the bros, of the business bros.

The, the, not the older Asian guy,

Jeremy: the white business bro.

Andi: No, no, the black one.

oh my God.

He's just the worst.

Like, and I've met people like that
and they're just, you can't say

anything to them because it, it's
like talking to a pile of silly putty.

It's, you get nowhere

Jeremy: Yeah I really enjoyed white
business, bro, being so sure that

he was gonna shatter that window
by throwing the, the chair at it

and it just bounced back at him.

Ben: Was he, wait, is that the one who
was uh, the roommate in Broad City?

Jeremy: Arturo Castro.

Sorin is the

Ben: Yes he was.

Yes.

He was in Broad City.

Jeremy: Okay.

Yep, he is.

Hi Mike Astro and bro.

Ben: Yes.

A lot of Castros.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, for me it is absolutely without
question Richard, the older man, because,

um, we find out some shit about that
dude as the movie goes on because like,

it's, it's obvious from the beginning
that like he and Margot know each other

and they don't want anybody else to know
that they know each other and Margot

does not want to be anywhere near him.

And it turns out we find out through her
conversation with the chef later on, that

uh, she found her escort time with him,
especially troubling because apparently

she looks like his daughter, which is why
he hired her to then watch him masturbate

and tell him that he was a good dad.

That scene I was like, oh
no, just murder this man now.

Ben: wasn't it like silly who
was like, that's fucked up.

And she was like, eh, nothing.

I see that, you know,
that's pretty normal.

Tell me I'm a good, I
masturbate like that.

that's on the standard menu.

Jeremy: Well, the, the watching, the
watching him masturbate and saying

nice things to him was the part that
she said, that's pretty standard.

And then she was bothered by the fact that
specifically he was asking her, to tell

him that he was a good dad and had hired
her because she looks like his daughter.

Andi: Yeah, that's like

seven different

levels of

fucked up.

Jeremy: Because the mom, Judith Light's,
character says, oh, she looks a lot

like our daughter, uh, at one point.

And then , you're like, and at
that point I was like, oh no.

Oh, no, no, no.

Ben: Ju Judith's light
character has a great moment.

At the end when Anya Taylor-Joy, like
is on her way out and she like turns

around like looking like not sure if
she should try to like rescue anyone

else, and Judith Light just tell us her.

Like, no, just go.

Just save yourself.

Everyone else here deserves to die.

You, you go.

I'm very fascinated by how this movie uses
cooking both literally and metaphorically.

Like, I think it uses cooking in
a metaphorical sense to discuss

like creativity or you know,
participation and capitalism.

And then there's the specific aspects of
the cooking industry, of the restaurant

industry that it also addresses.

Like, there's a real element, you
know, I feel like it's relatable to

anyone who in a creative industry
you know, Slowik's um, dying, love of

his passion and all the things that.

We know do kill creative passion,
like you know, the people who

control the purse strings that won't
let you create the way you want.

An audience that doesn't understand
what you're trying to achieve,

the compromises you make for
yourself to get where you wanna be.

Like it's all very relatable.

And then there's the aspects that I
are very specific I think, to cooking.

Like I don't have to deal with
people demanding bread in comics,

Jeremy: Yeah.

Andi: Yeah.

Ben: which

Jeremy: wanna speak to that at all, Andy?

The restaurant side of things and, and

Andi: Oh God.

Jeremy: going down for you.

Andi: So, I mean, alright, so I've
worked in a variety of restaurants.

Everything from like your standard sort
of divy sports bar to like fine dining,

like the Hawthorne level fine dining.

And it's never the work necessarily
that breaks people and drives

them out of the business.

It is always the people and whether that
be incompetent managers or the guests.

Those are the two main causes
of burnout in the industry.

And lately, especially, especially
after Covid, it's been a lot of the

guests because apparently being locked
up in their homes for a year makes

them think that they've got permission
to be just absolute shit birds.

Which, which blows my mind.

Ben: Really forgot how
to be fucking human.

Andi: it's almost like people forgot that
being a restaurant, that's a service.

It's not required.

Like, it, it, it's, it's not a Right, it's
a privilege . So the fuck you think you're

doing, coming in and demanding all sorts.

Like, there's nothing
wrong with substitution.

There's nothing wrong with, you know,
not wanting something on your dish,

but coming in and just demanding
something wholly off the menu because

you happened to show up that night.

Don't fuck

Ben: well now hold now, hold on.

I thought that was like in the
constitution that any like land owning

white person can demand like a BLT
from someone not getting paid enough

and they have to get that blt, like,
is that not like the fourth amendment?

I thought that was one of like the
weird ones that no one remembers.

Andi: Yeah, no.

If it was an amendment, it would
be like the 27th amendment just

past the repealing the prohibition.

Cause God knows we'd need alcohol
to deal with that amendment.

But

Ben: I mean, okay, so of all the
restaurant or the tiers of restaurants,

like from the sports bar to the Michelin
star, what class of clientele is the

worst in your, in your experience, not
at Universal, but in your experience?

Andi: See, that's like asking a parent
which child they favor the most.

It's impossible to answer
mostly because, all right.

I am gonna say that the current
clientele I am dealing with is probably

the best clientele I've ever had.

Just because they know where we
are, they know what our prices are.

They're expecting a certain level of.

Something and they're willing
to pay the price for it.

However, yeah, no.

Literally every other guest , like,
there is no, there's really

no dis You know what no.

There is one specific clientele, people
that are just the absolute worst.

I don't understand why they
exist and they keep going out.

They are the amateur hour crowd.

They are the people who insist on going
out on your major holidays, on weekends,

on like very high volume nights, and
then they, for some reason, can't

understand why there's a wait for a table.

It's like, mm, you.

, everybody else has had the exact
same idea that you did, and

none of y'all are gonna tip.

So we have no incentive to,
skew anything in your favor.

Ben: So, pretty much if someone was like,
Hey, I wanna invest in you, the money

and resources to kill a restaurant full
of 12 customers you hate, the biggest

problem would be narrowing it down.

Andi: yes, but it would be really easy
because I'd make sure that the, the day

that I killed everybody would be on St.

Patrick's Day.

Cause that is like the biggest
amateur hour of them all.

Ben: I, I, I'm glad you've never had
to work in New York during Santa.

Andi: Oh no.

But I participated in, I
participated in Atlanta and,

Ben: oh, you might be a monster

Andi: Once upon a time I
was, and then I outgrew it.

Yes.

Ben: like the baby in that skit
from, I think you should leave.

We all can.

We can all change.

Andi: Yes,

Ben: it used to be a piece of shit.

If you, I'm not actually
calling Andy a piece of shit.

That's a reference to the, I
think you should leave skit,

which if you haven't seen,

Andi: I am,

Ben: it.

It's a great show.

Andi: but I am a piece
of shit, so it's fine.

Ben: Oh yeah.

Just sleek bag hair and sloppy
steaks all over the place.

Andi: Yep, yep.

Jeremy: a sloppy steak.

Ben: How great was Nicholas
Hodges lapping up like just olive

oil with the tiny wooden and
spoon like the breathless bread.

Andi: the, the bread, not bread, light.

Jeremy: there's stuff early in
the movie where I'm like, I'm a

little bit on his side where she is
like, oh, I'm gonna send it back.

And he is like, you're embarrassing me.

Like I, I paid for this.

Like, just chill.

And I'm like, oh, okay.

He's right.

And then immediately he, he
calls her a child and I was like,

all right, back off your team.

Andi: Yeah.

Ben: I mean, they do play it well in
the beginning where like it really

does seem like, oh, they're a new cap.

And then it's just like, oh,
he just, bought an fucking

completely innocent escort that
he deemed completely expendable

for his quest of death by great.

Andi: Yeah.

Which it's really funny.

If you ask any actual restaurant
worker or chef, they don't

wanna die having a great meal.

No, we and I, I've talked to enough
people, I think there's a general

consensus anytime that we get the
impression that we are about to die,

we're all just gonna go buy a shitload
of heroin and go out in a blaze of glory.

So as fun as these theatrics would be.

We're not wasting our
time getting revenge.

No, we're going out partying.

Ben: that's also my plan.

If I make it to like 85, like if I make
it to 85, I'm just gonna start getting

into like the really hardcore drugs.

Who's gonna, what's
the harm at that point?

Be like, no, that 88 year old
person is ruining their life.

They, they'll never be able to do
all the things with their, I don't

know, four months of life left.

Oh man.

Fucking like I, and I don't know, I really
like, I find the cheeseburger verse fine

dining thing, like really interesting.

Like I, not a universal thing,
but the way it's presented for how

slow like presents it I think is so
interesting because it really feels

like a writer up their own ass.

Who can't we talk about like the
themes and the issues it's gonna

explore and how important the work.

And then someone just being like,
Hey, make a thing that's enjoyable.

Make food that's tasty.

Andi: and here- here's what I find really
funny about the fact that she does ask

for a burger at the end of this, because,
In fine dining restaurants, cheeseburgers

have become a bit of a fad thing.

Like there was a solid five years where
every fucking fine dining restaurant in

Atlanta had a smash burger or a smash
patty, or it was just another version

of two shittily fucking fried burger
patties with onions and American cheese.

And it, it, it was
supposed to be like this.

Oh my God.

It's so gourmet and it's
so juicy and delicate.

Like the last place I worked had a fucking
smash, a double smash burger, and I had

to instruct the servers stop asking people
what they want their temperature to be.

You're not gonna get a
temperature with this burger.

It's just gonna be two fully cooked
patties with cheese and some weird

mystery sauce and heads up everywhere.

The mystery sauce is mayonnaise,
ketchup, and relish all mixed together.

That's it.

That is all it

is.

Ben: I didn't know about the
relish, but I did figure it was

Mayo and ketchup mix together.

Andi: Yeah, no.

Also, chuck in some
fucking relish in there.

And Ben, you got your Big Mac sauce.

Ben: Are you telling me that
the, that the cinematic classic

Nickelodeon's good burger lied to me.

Andi: actually good Burger may have been
the most honest of the burger movies

cause definitely we're injecting massive
amounts of hormones into our burgers,

Ben: If you haven't seen
Good Burger in a while, that.

That's my recommendation.

If you like the menu,
go watch Good Burger.

Nickelodeon made a fucking a straight
up stoner movie and then gave it to

children fucking like, incredible.

Jeremy: you know,

Ben: It holds up.

It's still very funny.

Jeremy: that reminds me of my immediate
reaction, which I, I sent you on

Twitter after watching this movie
is I was like, it's a reverse rati.

Like she,

Ben: To which my immediate reaction was,
wait, who wrote on and controlled a rat?

Did Tyler do that?

Did Tyler have rat power?

And then you make a good point how
yes, you explain how it is a reverse.

Cuz once you explain, I'm like,
that is a very good analysis.

Jeremy: Yeah, because the, the conclusion
in Tui, how they get a good review

from the food critic is they cook
something that he loved as a child and

remind him why he liked food and why
he got into this in the first place.

And that's how Omnia
Taylor-Joy gets out of it.

uh, she sees the picture of him
smiling, being the employee of the

month at the burger place, and um, asks
her to make him a good cheeseburger

or make her a good cheeseburger.

pays him 10 bucks for it and uh,
enjoys it and thanks him, which

is like all he fucking wants.

He just wants to make food that people
like, enjoy and thank him for and are

like, happy about at the end of the
day, which like is the thing that has

been ruined for him is like, these,
he's making stuff for these people

who just want to, just want to pay
to complain to like, you know, just

like these business bros are all sort
of like talking about how oh, they've

been to this better place, they've got
this different version of this thing.

And he is like, he just wants to
like, make people food that they love.

I said to Alicia at one point after
watching this cuz you know, she's she's in

grad school now, but she was a teacher for
a long time and anytime that she talked

about like wanting to make more money and
the fact that teachers need to make more

money and raises, people would always be
like, oh, you should be an administrator.

And she's like, no, I
don't wanna be a principal.

Nobody that teaches
wants to be a principal.

That's a different job.

Like, that's a whole
different type of job.

I was like, that feels like what
this guy is stuck in is like

he got really good at cooking.

and so they put him in a position where
like he doesn't get to cook and he doesn't

get to enjoy like making food anymore.

Ben: Well, what to me made the movie
work and I, I think without this, there

would've been a level of hypocrisy
and self justification that I think

would've ruined Slowik as a villain.

Is that total willingness to
kill himself as part of the plan?

because it means him owning up
to his own level of culpability.

Like nobody put a gun to his head
and made him open a restaurant

that charges $1,250 per person.

Like he points out like, oh, my
food has reached a point where the

only people who can afford it now
are those who can't appreciate it.

No one made you fucking
charge those prices.

the fact that he embraces his own
culpability, it, it just makes

his philosophy very consistent to
me and kind of saves the movie.

I think

Andi: And that is why I'd like to
object to your calling him a villain

because clearly he's a hero, obviously.

Jeremy: Yeah,

Ben: mean,

Jeremy: like,

Ben: an anti villain, anti-hero.

He, the people certainly deserve to die
by his own very clear moral standard.

Jeremy: yeah.

That he has like, sort of
admittedly ruined his own life,

that he has, become a monster.

That he is, become the sort of person
that harasses his, you know, sous chef

who's just like trying to make food and
trying to get by in the industry, and like

he recognizes his own monster quality at
that point, you know, that he that he is.

to blame in all of this, and then
he deserves to first be stabbed

and then eventually be, you know,
burned alive with everybody else.

I do think, if, you know, instead of
people having to like, I don't know,

go through whatever it is that people
supposedly have to go through when

they're canceled, if, you know, they
just gave the people in question a

chance to stab them I think things
would probably blow over faster.

I think.

I think people would be more

Ben: Matt Lauer, I am not saying
you'd get the morning show.

But it couldn't hurt to try.

I mean, you know, beyond
the, the stabbing hurt

Andi: I mean, I think Mark
Wallberg and Matt Lauer would

probably wind up like Caesar.

That's a lot of stabbing.

That's a lot of stabbing

Ben: I mean, to me, where it about
is kind of in its own way about a

creator meeting a young muse, and
then being knocked out of his creative

funk is just like, you know, that
reminder of a purpose and a joy.

Because like these preambles,
he gives all of these courses.

It's like, oh, I want you to eat the, I
want you to consume an entire ecosystem

and feel the These are the tacos of
guilt, this meal of like vegetable

cubes and a bone represents like
creative, like dreams, failure dreams.

And then like by the end, it's.

This is a burger.

It's meant to be tasty
and fill your belly.

Andi: Oh.

Ben: Like, she's right.

Like he's not like all of these
big messages and you know, they

took about the meaning of the menu.

I like that when she calls him out on
his shit, like she's kind of right.

It's like, if you wanna love cooking then
cook shit you love instead of all of this

crazy fucking like, thought piece shit.

Andi: tweezer to death nonsense.

I mean, this is the stuff that
Anthony Bourdain had been railing

against for years before his death.

Kind of refreshing to
see it in a movie form.

. Ben: So I did have a question for
you Andy, cuz I feel like with

everything going on you would have a
better sense with how your knowledge

what the food critic is saying.

Is she entirely just like
full of shit, just looking for

things to just like nitpick?

Or does she have some legit points when
she's like critiquing some of this stuff?

Andi: No, she's 100% up around
ass, like in any industry, be it

food, art, what have you, critics
are the lowest form of occupation.

it's very much the same thing as, you
know, if you can't do teach, which I

don't believe that because I've met
teachers, a lot of teachers are decent

people that are trying to actually
educate people, but then they're critics.

Critics are the true if
you can't do critique.

But the problem is, is because
they can't do, they don't know what

they're supposed to be critiquing,
and so they just, they just wind up.

It's just Yelp.

It's just Yelp.

And Yelp is the worst, worst,
worst resource on the planet.

So it's, yeah.

No, I have, very little
respect for food critics.

I have a lot of respect for food writers
because although they start off as food

critics, food writers will take the
time to learn and investigate and try to

understand what they're talking about.

Food critics generally don't, so yeah, no.

, the critic definitely deserved to die
in this without, without, question.

Ben: even when she laughed off that
the tortillas were of restaurants whose

like closed down after her reviews.

Andi: Exactly.

Yeah.

The fact that she was so callous
about like ending people's

livelihoods to fuck her.

Ben: I'm disappointed that none of the
business brochures shoved a tortilla in

their mouth thinking that that would mean
the evidence was gone and they were okay.

Like, like clearly it only
exists on this one tortilla.

Jeremy: I love, I.

That conversation between the
business Bros and Hong Chau, where

like the guy's like, what is this?

And he's like, that's a tortilla.

And he is like, no, no,
I get, it's a tortilla.

Like what the fuck is this?

Why does it have all these things on it?

It's a tortilla.

Tortilla deliciosa.

So

Andi: Yeah.

Yeah.

Ben: hung chow is a fucking gift.

The moment that I fucking love is
in the bread list, bread plate.

When like they're being like,
fucking bring a secret bread.

It's okay.

We technically own the place.

And she just fucking
whispers in Arturo's ear.

What is it?

Uh, You will eat less than you
desire, but more than you deserve.

Jeremy: it's the coldest
shit that's Oh my.

Ben: Ice cold, fucking amazing.

Andi: Yep.

Ben: Like the mask just
falls and it's great.

Andi: Yep.

It's Good stuff.

Ben: there is all the really just
how fucking hatable just all these

people are like um, you know, the
couple that have apparently have

been 10 times in two years, which
again, 1250 per person per meal.

Andi: Yeah, that's so much fucking money.

Ben: and they can't name a single thing
that they've eaten at this restaurant.

It reminds me of just like,
the, some of the people on each

channels on YouTube that focus.

Very heavily on like superhero
movies and TV shows, not general.

Look, I get that.

There's some people who are like,
that's there been their entryway

and that's really, they're
not too interested in comics.

They're okay with movies and
television and that's what they

want to hear and talk about.

No problem at all.

All the power, however you get into
a fandom is totally, totally legit.

But like the people that like
are really negative and try to

like drag down as like hang on.

Especially, you know, especially
changes to make things a more

diverse and that kind of thing.

And use how things were in the comics
as their for why things can't be

changed or just like to be almost
like just these toxic campaigns.

And I almost wanna shake some of
these people and be like, name me a

fucking comic artist, motherfucker.

Like, show me a for all the, the
bullshit hate you're spewing.

Show me a comic you read that
isn't fucking killing Joker.

Dark Knight returns.

Andi: Yep.

Yep.

Jeremy: Yeah.

I I know that feel.

Yeah, and I think that's a lot
of the point of this movie.

Ben: You know, I'll say like the people
complaining about comedy and fourth wall

break in She Hulk who have no fucking
idea that a Dan Slott run even exists.

Jeremy: Yeah,

literally every runner she hulk is, is
fourth wall bricky and funny and weird.

Ben: If you made a YouTube video that
inv had the word she Hulk and woke

in the title, I Fucking Hate You and
don't want you listening to our show.

I can't imagine someone
that was listening.

NI Lake has gone this far into
this podcast has been like, fuck.

I thought they were, I thought,
I thought progressively horrified

was a conservative show.

Jeremy: right there in the name.

Andi: I mean, you'd be surprised.

There's a Scott comedian that I enjoy,
Daniel Sloss, excellent comedian.

He's released a few specials on Netflix.

He released one special solely
on his website that I bought and

streamed and all of his material
has always been very progressive.

But in this particular special there was
a literal Nazi in his audience, that

they had to kick out . And it was it
became like this whole like, fucking bit.

He's like, how did he not know that I.

.
What

Jeremy: every time.

Every time Tom Morello opens his mouth
and somebody's like, rage against the

machine has gotten so woke, I'm just
like, what the fuck is wrong with you?

Ben: Oh, I'm a big fan of uh, anytime
we get Star Trek has gone, woke.

Jeremy: Oh,

Andi: oh

Ben: I, I'm sorry.

Gene Roddenberry's Socialist Pan Racial
Utopia is literal on the progressive side.

Andi: Hmm.

Yep.

Yep.

It's what, so we talked about our least
favorite characters on the menu, but

can I point out my favorite character?

Of all time on this?

The mom.

The mom that just sits in the
corner drinking wine, like-

Ben: a fucking in What an
incredible element of the movie

that she doesn't say anything.

Andi: doesn't say a fucking word.

She clearly knows what's going on,
and she just keeps waving over the

samila and just like, fill it up.

Fill it up.

Yeah.

We're all going to, hell just fill it up.

My God, I hope to be
that kind of a grandma.

Jeremy: That scene where everybody
else has gone outside for the man's

folly bit and she like gets up
from her table to walk over to the

bucket and get another bottle of
wine, goes right back to the table.

Ben: I, my favorite bit in the
man's folly is when all the

men run away except for Taylor.

And they have to be like, no, you too.

And he just kind of like sas off.

Andi: it's like you're not special.

Ben: what's gonna happen.

Like, but like God, yeah, like
he really does like for as fucked

up as a little weirdo as he is.

they portrayed in a surprisingly
not toxic way, but I really think

Tyler to a degree, shows like the
level of ownership that fervent

fandom feels over a creative process.

Andi: Hmm.

Jeremy: Yeah I that in allyship
that he thinks that he's the one

guy who can just uh, stay with
the women and hang out there.

And that like, I don't know, whatever it
is he thinks he has or hasn't done, he

doesn't think that uh, the men being men
having a Foley and having to run away

from the guys actually applies to him.

He just thinks he gets to stay with
the women and is jealous of them for,

you know, getting an extra course.

Ben: oh yeah.

Even though he should have been fucking
trying to hide really hard if he,

because then you get the extra last
person to be found like dessert egg,

Andi: Yep.

Ben: Which I love that.

How.

they find them and then like
closed up the chicken coop

like, like this movie is funny.

Like darkly funny but funny.

Now I fucking love this movie.

Andi: so I've had this movie playing.

While we're watching or while we're, while
we're talking and we've just gotten the

part it's about to be Tyler's bullshit.

And I gotta say, I kind of love the
shot where Ralph is scribbling Tyler's

name onto the chef coat because it
really highlights the difference in

height between Tyler and the chef.

it's such a reversal of stereotypes
because normally somebody being

bullied would be the taller person.

Right?

But no, this is now

Ben: I, I call Tyler A.

Little weird though, a lot, mostly
because that's the energy he brings

Andi: a hundred percent.

Ben: Nicholas Health is still his
normal six three in this movie.

Andi: And, and good old Mr.

Fiennes is not by a long shot,

Jeremy: Nah.

Andi: He's so intimidating
at that stature.

It's like, God damn.

Jeremy: well, he's chilling
throughout this movie.

I mean, we talked about, you

know, him, him being scarier than his,
his Nazi character in Schindler's List.

But the way that they do the clapping

Ben: Uh, the clapping.

Oh my

God.

Jeremy: they play with it with the
sound effects, where it goes, whoosh.

When he claps, like there's
a sound before him clapping.

But the like way that everybody
turns when he does it is just,

it's chilling, it's cultish.

And then I, like, I know it's a thing.

But it's, it's really,
it's chilling in the movie.

Andi: So I about that clapping
because I love that clapping.

mostly because so I do wine
tastings at the restaurant that

I work at for private groups.

And sometimes they're not paying
attention to their schedule.

They, they know that they've got a
lot, an allotted amount of time, but

they're too busy bullshitting, so
they're not paying attention to me.

So I've actually adopted the
clap and holy shit, it works.

Cause there's just something,
very, like, you just snap to

attention anytime you hear a

Jeremy: It goes all the way back to

Andi: and it just, and it just stops.

Like everything stops.

And it's just like, oh, I didn't
mean to command, I mean, I did

mean to command all your attention.

I didn't expect it to be that jarring,
but you know what, I'm gonna take it.

And it's wonderful.

That is now one of my, it
is such a power move and I'm

never gonna stop doing it now.

So,

Ben: Hell yeah

Andi: sorry.

All future wine tasting groups.

If you're gonna be rude, I'm
gonna be, I'm gonna be clapping.

Ben: Speaking of power moves, how would
you feel if you started a new job at

a restaurant, you're new to a kitchen
and the executive chef made you yell?

Yes, chef.

And perfect unison with the
rest of the kitchen staff.

And he would say, I love you, and
you would all have to say back in.

Still in unison.

We love you too.

Andi: I mean, I would definitely
do it in the moment, but I

would never return to that job.

Ben: Oh no.

You have to do it in the moment because
if you don't, they are gonna kill you.

I mean, that level of
cult energy, you, you

gotta play along until you're safe.

Andi: like there, there's, certain
levels of cult energy that I'm willing

to work with and um, you know what?

That, that crosses the line a bit.

But you know, I'll play the game
until I can get out of there safely.

Ben: That's a very sim, that's
a very similar line you have

to find when you're working at
tech startups in Silicon Valley.

Is, is how cultish you can handle before
you just gotta bounce the fuck outta.

Andi: Yeah, and what's funny is I work
for a place now that is quasi culty,

but it's still less culty than that.

So it's.

Jeremy: Yeah.

The, the whole like living on
the island and everything and

that is, is really creepy.

I, I think my favorite characters in this,
it's, it's- I find Ray find's performance

really charismatic and, and interesting.

But like, uh, for me it's between
Elsa, the Hong Chau character.

And, actually Margot like Anya
Taylor-Joy's character because the scene

where he is grilling Nicholas Hoult
about like that he knew the whole time

and he admits that like he invited her
there knowing that she was going to die.

She goes over that table to him like,

Ben: Oh, she is ready to just fucking.

I'm right then and

Jeremy: yeah,

Andi: Oh

Jeremy: cuz she is, I mean, again,
Nicholas Hoult is not a small guy

and under Taylor-Joy is pretty small
except for her eyes, Richard Giant.

But she like comes across
that table like she's going to

absolutely destroy this guy.

Ben: it's not her fault,
she's a quarter anime girl.

I think my favorite character
is the fake Coast Guard.

Andi: Ooh.

Ben: Just everything from like how, yeah,
from like when he is fanning out about

Gen John, like Zamo, when he is like,
turns around and when he does like the

spin around with the gun and like just
everyone's really, and then he just, and

then he just starts singing the Happy
birthday, like the lighter, like he's got

one scene, but he fucking does magic with.

Andi: He owns it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Ben: Oh,

Jeremy: Yeah.

But then Hong Chau in, in her scenes
is very, like they, they play her as

intense, but she is also like, Very funny
and a very like, controlled, scary way.

You know, the, the , again, the, the
number of times she says it's a tortilla

to those dudes is hilarious to me.

And the, you know, the whole action
scene where she's trying to, to

stab on you Taylor-Joy, and they're
bullying things at each other.

Ben: Oh, and we, and we
get the great what is it?

Chekhov's, a Paco gun, a Paco cannon.

The frost thing, I, I don't say
this very often, but I was bait

just going into this movie fresh,
only having seen the trailers.

I was pleasantly surprised
by the lack of cannibalism.

Jeremy: Right.

That was a, that was a thing going in
that I was like, there's definitely

going to be an element of cannibalism.

And then like, once you see the island,
I was like, there's gonna be a whole most

dangerous game thing going on here at

Ben: Oh, right.

Like absolutely.

Jeremy: can't leave.

And I guess they do uh, you know,
short play on that with them

running away, but like, not really.

Ben: Almost like a, it's almost like a,
a play act take on it of like what you

like, but again, what they do instead
is so much more unique and interesting.

I think.

Jeremy: is written by two like guys that
their main writing credits are the Onion.

Like, you know, they write for the
Onion, they write for The Onion.

Wrote for the Onion News
Network when that was on.

You know, they, they've done
a lot of like comedy stuff.

One of 'em is written for Seth Meyers.

They did a lot of college humor stuff.

So like, yeah.

Seth, Seth Reiss and Will Tracy, like

right.

It's

Andi: I love That I love that

Ben: that makes sense.

This again, this movie is funny.

This movie has a very deft sense of humor.

Jeremy: it's such an
interesting combination of them.

And then like Mark Mylod directing.

Cause like Mark Mylod has done like
hundreds of TV episodes and he is

done a lot of like, you know, less
well known, less successful stuff.

And then of course, a minority report
and like our, the Minority Report TV

series, like Game of Thrones, shameless,

um, Succession.

He is, you know, directed several
of episodes from these things.

Like he directed the allergy
into house movie So like, got

a lot of stuff under his belt.

And it's just like, this is a combination
of people that I, I would not have

ever thought of for a film like this.

And it just comes together.

So.

Ben: would you almost say the uh,
the ingredients come together,

Jeremy: Yeah,

Ben: it all together.

Jeremy: there's uh, some

Andi: The

souffle of

Ben: you you grill up a para writers, a
melted director on top, serve it with some

crinkle cast, and uh, you got yourself
a movie that was fucking tortured.

Jeremy: full disclosure, I've been
watching this at the same point that

Alicia and I are making our way through
the bear which is a very different thing

about working in a restaurant which

I

described.

I described watching the bear as
having somebody else's heart attack,

Ben: The, the bear is
to like give Normies.

Just a taste of what working
in a restaurant is like.

And I think the menu is
meant to be the catharsis for

restaurant workers everywhere.

Andy, is that accurate?

Andi: vary because I cannot get through 15
minutes of the first episode of the Bear.

Because it's very much a, oh God,
this is PTSD in the worst way.

so

Jeremy: episode is the worst for that.

Like, as we've gotten further into
it, it's, it's, it feels less like

I'm going to have a heart attack
while I'm watching the show.

Ben: Like, uh, the show, Barry, when I
talk to combination hitman assassin, like

assassin actors talk to assassin actors.

They can't watch Barry.

They say it's too real.

They've all, They've all, got their own.

No-no.

Hank that in real life,

Andi: yeah, no, it, it, it's
very much like I would love

to be able to watch the bear.

I just can't because it puts me in this
terrible head space and I just, I go dark.

I go real dark and I'm, I'm a dark
enough human being already, meanwhile,

the menu, it's like, it makes me.

just

Ben: Yeah, that that checks out

Andi: it, It's the same amount of trauma.

However, there's some retribution,
whereas in the bear, there

is no hint of retribution.

That I can tell though, again,
I've only seen the first 15 minutes

of the first episode and I could

Ben: the bear.

The bear is like when the monster,
the killers are chasing you.

And then the menu is the act
three violence catharsis switch.

When you get to start doing violence
against the original attackers.

Andi: Right.

Ben: I mean light blowers for the bear,
one supporting character's subplot is he

gets so obsessed with making the perfect
donut that it nearly destroys his life.

Jeremy: Yeah, I,

Andi: So

that sounds like four people I

used to work with.

Jeremy: a couple episodes from
the end of the Bear right now.

And I think maybe an episode that I, I
both liked and bothered me the most was

uh, an episode where the uh, the main
character's cousin leaves his Xanax

out on the table at the kid's birthday
party, and it ends up in the juice

And,

Ben: Oh yes.

Jeremy: the main character is looking
around and discovers that all the

kids have passed out on the lawn

Ben: My favorite part about that
is, and from what I understand from

Chicago people, is very accurate.

The conversation about not bringing
ketchup for hot dogs, which makes sense.

You're a fucking adult.

Put mustard and or relish on that mustard
for me, but you know, to each their own.

Andi: Hi.

I'm a monster that puts ketchup,
mustard, and hot sauce on my hot dogs.

Ben: Well, that's fine.

That in combination of things.

That's okay.

Jeremy: yeah, I'm in the south.

We put chilian slaw on hotdogs here.

Ben: Yeah.

Chili dog.

Good old chili cheese

Jeremy: North Carolina.

Andi: Oh, north Cadillac.

I got you all

Jeremy: right.

There's a Carolina style dog.

You, you put that in there and you
get some uh, some mustard, maybe

some relish on there as well.

Andi: Yeah, yeah, I

Ben: uh,

Jeremy: the bun isn't falling apart.

It's not a real hot.

Ben: I live in New York, so our
hotdogs are now halal kabobs.

If you haven't been to New York since
the 1990s, all of the hotdog like

places got replaced with halal stance.

I don't know what kind of fucking
food stamp pur for happened behind the

scenes, but the halal guys won big time.

Andi: but they still serve hot dogs.

They're just not the
right dirty water hot.

Ben: Exactly.

Get the c, get the chicken.

It's be,

it's tastier, but get the
red and the white sauce.

Andi: Oh

Ben: Oh man.

So a fun little anecdote I have about
the menu while I've got y'all captive

is when I had my partner see it, I
made us burgers beforehand and promise

that I had stuff for smores for.

And then got to see her face as we got to
the ending and she realized what I'd done.

Andi: Oh, that must have been magical.

Jeremy: Did Jamaica wear a
hat made of of chocolate?

Ben: Kathleen just turned to me and was
like, you motherfucker, you know, if

Kathleen was capable of saying
motherfucker, but she too.

Cinnamon roll.

Andi: That's, that's perfect.

I love.

Ben: okay.

The ch the hats okay

Jeremy: That might be my
favorite thing, is those melting

crowns of chocolate at the end,

Ben: Yes.

How fucking hard, how hardcore was
that imagery of like the dripping

chocolate, like tears of chocolate
running down their faces, the

flames run up, the marshmallows.

Like, holy shit.

What an incredible
death, like death scene.

That was the death by smore.

Andi: Just, just fucking
brilliant, honestly.

Like I've seen, okay, at this point
I've now seen this movie seven times.

I adore it so much and I've been
showing it to everybody who will

give me five minutes of their time,
you know, an hour and 50 minutes.

Yeah.

So every single time I've watched
it, there's been two questions

that people have asked me.

What the fuck is the deal with the
grandma in the corner, which eventually

gets answered and then like, oh my God,
how could you ever eat s'mores again?

Ben: How could you not?

Andi: right?

Like this is, this is my bread and butter.

is,

Jeremy: I have chocolate graham
crackers and marshmallows?

Well, then I'm making smores.

Andi: yeah,

it's like

Ben: Meanwhile, I do wanna see if
there's a way to salvage Tyler's

bullshit, because I feel like lamb
chops and uh, like an elite butter

leak sauce and leak and shallot sauce
like, Should be on the tasty side.

If you're not a complete fuck up,

Andi: 100%, like there is a,
there is a good way to do that.

Tyler's bullshit could be a good item.

It's just that he was so pressured
and such a shit cook that he

undercooked the chop and he didn't
bother sauteing anything enough.

It, like, he just, he didn't take the
time nor paid the enough attention.

So yeah, of course this
stuff was bullshit.

Ben: I do think it.

would've been really f I think it
would've would've been really funny is

because the whole place thing says how
rushed and pressured he is, is if he

managed to keep, okay cool, and picked
a recipe that's like, okay, now it's

gotta go on the oven for 40 minutes.

What do we do while we wait?

Jeremy: Yeah.

I think like as somebody who watched a lot
of like great British Bake off before the

pandemic and then was like, all right, I'm
gonna cook a lot of desserts and stuff.

Now I relate to the like, . Oh,
I've seen this done so many

times, but I have no idea how to
actually do it uh, side of things,

Ben: I'd like to think that if he
had managed to make something decent,

it would've been like, okay, you
get to stand in the corner when

we do, like while everyone dies,

Andi: Yep.

Ben: like you, you get a c
plus, you don't get to be in the

kitchen, but you get something.

You can serve min outside the He can be
the boss boy if he hadn't fucked it up,

which again after, I mean, it's so good
that they do it right after the reveal.

That he knew they were all going to die
because when you're at the maximum hating

him, you just get like, God, that's one.

It's one of the finest on-screen
humiliations I've ever seen

Andi: and it, it kind of, it, it
kind of makes me wonder like how

many of these other guests got
that same email, like, oh, hey,

just a heads up, you're gonna die.

And they just ignored it,

Ben: sent to spam.

Andi: yeah.

Ben: I mean, it seemed like it was
all like Tyler individual, like it

seemed like, my guess is that Tyler
was just sending lots of emails and

like fan emails to my, Ralph was
like, how hard, how far can this go?

He was like, I'm just gonna tell him.

Like, I bet I could straight up
tell this guy I want to murder him

and I'll still fucking show up.

Andi: And he did.

Ben: And he did like, like.

He had such special contempt for
Tyler that was so well deserved.

Like, God, just like

Jeremy: we haven't even talked about,

the fact that they say specifically
the chef, like one of the few

rules is he does not want them
to take pictures of the food.

He wants the food to be ephemeral.

It's there and then it's not,
and it's about the experience.

And the first thing Tyler does is just
start taking pictures of the food.

You know, he doesn't
ask, he doesn't anything.

He just assumes.

It's because it's him, you
know, and he's a fan that, that

the rules don't apply to him.

And I think that goes back to your,
your fandom point with Tyler being

Ben: it's, it's very satisfying
seeing him just die inside.

Andi: Yeah.

Jeremy: Yeah.

That you don't even hear what the
chef says to him, but like, you know,

you know what the end result of that
is before they actually show it.

Ben: But like even before the whisper
and he goes to like hang himself,

it's just, Just on this, this what,
this grand stage that like, that

all these years he spent being like,
Ooh, make believe chef, I'm a fan.

Like, ooh, I would totally be great
at it and successful, like, you know,

if I want, if I really wanted to, if
I really tried knowing that like they,

you know, the idea of being it is
always more appealing than being it.

And just having that fantasy that
he is been clearly sustaining

himself with just being so shattered
is just so satisfying to watch.

Cuz he is ah, Nicholas out.

Really just becoming, again, like I said,
just one of Hollywood's great actors

who can play a great fucking weirdo.

Like if you put him and Jake Gillen Hall
together, that movie would be too weird.

You wouldn't be allowed to release it.

Andi: no, it, there'd be so much we,
we'd probably wind up accidentally

calling Kalu into the plane of
existence and nobody needs that.

Jeremy: I think you wouldn't even have
to, like, we didn't have to hire him.

David Kronenberg would just
show up to direct that movie.

Andi: Yep.

Ben: it's so funny watching late
two thousands, early 2010s, Jake Joe

in Hall films when they were really
trying to make of just like a generic

Hollywood handsome white guy leading man.

And there's just like the soul of
the most like fucking fidget of

like just the weirdest motherfucker
just fighting to get out.

And then night crawler happens
and he is like, this is all

I'm fucking doing from now on.

Just fucking weirdos forever.

Or as I like to call it the uh,
Daniel Radcliffe Elijah Wood route.

Jeremy: Radcliffe especially.

Ben: Oh my God.

Make your franchise money mad early
and then just fucking go crazy.

Like, and then just fucking
do the most out there.

Shit.

Like, Hey Elijah Wood,
you did Lord of the Rings.

What's next?

I'm gonna do it with sitcom
when I hallucinate about an a

Australian dog who's mean to me.

Andi: or I'm going to do a zombie movie.

With kids.

Call it cooties.

Done.

Ben: Also, yeah.

Watch Wilfred.

You haven't seen Wilfred watch Wilfred.

Jeremy: You wanna talk about dark.

Ben: Oh my God, right.

Right.

Andi: Need to watch Cuties.

Oh my God.

Just watch Cuties.

Ben: Like, if it's Elijah Wood
and it's post Lord of the Rings,

you're gonna have a fun time and
it's gonna be like nothing else.

Andi: Yep.

Jeremy: We haven't even talked
about Daniel Radcliffe doing Swiss

Army, man, the Daniel's first movie
before, they calmed down to do

everywhere and everything everywhere.

All at once.

Andi: Yeah.

Ben: that was after Daniel Radcliffe
immediately followed up Harry,

Potter with, I'm gonna Appear
naked with a horse in a play.

Andi: Look, if Chris
is a piece of art, deal

Ben: I didn't say it wasn't.

Jeremy: So I, I guess we should ask
now do we think the menu is feminist?

Andi: Oh, that's a great question.

Ben: Ooh,

Andi: hmm.

Ben: I don't feel like it's very,

Andi: It's

Ben: mean, ooh,

Andi: anti-feminist.

Ben: definitely not anti-feminist.

You do have that interesting element.

Slow admits to sexually harassing
one of his employees who is

then allowed to stab him,

Andi: Right.

And then like, well, they do also
allow the women to all like sit

and gather together and, Hmm.

Jeremy: I think the most important
thing is that it's, it's shown from

this perspective of a woman who is a
sex worker, who is not like, shamed

for being a sex worker in this movie.

Like the chef talks to her on a like
person to person, we're both people

that are in a service industry.

You know, do, do you
like what you used to do?

Well, I, or I used to like what
I do, I don't like it anymore.

And they're, they're both sort of

Ben: what the movie does very well,
is the explicitly pro sex worker.

It's main character is a sex
worker who is presented as.

Intelligent, empathetic, clever,
a human inherently moral person.

This sex worker is explicitly
presented as the only character

in the movie deserving of Life.

Like that is the explicit
message of the movie.

So, you know what?

I think that, you know, grounding the
narrative around and giving utmost

humanity to you know, a profession
that is so often so completely

demonized in media and news.

So, uh, you know, I

I, think you definitely gotta give it,

Andi: yeah, it's feminist.

is in a, in a, in a very dark way.

It is very feminist.

Ben: Yeah.

Andi: So to be fair, I would also
let a room of people burn to let

myself survive slash get ahead.

So, depends on what your
definition of feminist is,

Ben: Yeah, but no, I, I
definitely agree with you.

It's not anti-feminist,
it's not anti-women.

Andi: No, it's very, it's very pro-women.

In fact, I mean, the fact that
they allowed the, the sous

chef who was harassed to even
speak her truth was a big deal.

Ben: Yeah.

Now I, how this movie does on race,
I mean, there is one moment that we

didn't mention that is really funny is
Slowik quoting Martin Luther King, Jr.

And then the business bros, most of whom
are people of color just being like yeah,

what the fuck Did he just quote mlk?

It was so fucking funny.

Andi: yeah.

Jeremy: Yeah.

I think the casting for the most
part feels a little colorblind.

Like, it, it doesn't really matter
which one of the business bros

is black and which one is Asian.

They don't really have anything.

There's not really
anything to do with that.

Ben: Yeah.

John, like, Zamo and his assistant,
you know, conversationally speaks

Spanish to one another uh, at
a few points during the movie.

So, yeah.

I do think there's a real Yeah.

Kind of race blind,

Jeremy: it's, it's much more
interested in class than, than race.

Ben: Yes.

Andi: let's,

to be fair, to be fair, and I hate to
say this, but nine times outta 10 when a

specific class is sitting in a restaurant,
they're all very exceptionally Caucasian.

It it, it's very rare that there is.

People of color in restaurants like
these, which it, it's not right.

It's 120% unfortunate, but that's
just, that's just the really

upsetting reality of things.

Like this is probably the most diverse
dining room that a Michelin restaurant

has seen in quite a lot, quite a while,
and it's a pretend restaurant in a movie.

So that.

It's just the unfortunate way it is.

Ben: I mean, it is.

interesting to me the way this movie
explores um, fine dining as like an

exclusionary thing cuz you know, you
look at something like TV or like

movies, whether it's, you know, um,
fucking like the Woman King or Boss Baby.

You go to the theater,
it's gonna cost the same,

Andi: Mm-hmm.

Ben: whether you are making the most
high brow, high quality film, it

costs the exact same amount as, you
know, just uh, cheap out, gross out,

you know, kids' comedy or something.

you know, you don't get
that in other mediums.

That sense of like, oh, well, as it
gets better, it gets more expensive

and therefore less people deserve it.

Jeremy: Yeah, I mean, I do think, you
know, that there is something to be said

for the fact that this movie doesn't
have to have any people of color in it.

It could, it could be
straight up white people.

And they, you know, they
do make the effort to cast

people of color in the movie.

And yeah, that the, the class stuff
is, is really interesting and it's

sort of writ large on the movie
that the movie is largely about

class and how class destroys art.

How rich people exclude poor people from
art and in doing so also destroy it.

Ben: Yeah.

I mean, it's,

I'm glad it had the bit about the angel
investor literally being drowned because

this has been kinda a time when there's
a lot of turmoil in the entertainment

industry deals being reneged.

Uh, Shows being canceled, mid production
content being just ripped from streaming

services, things being turned into
tax, writeoffs, like layoffs across the

board, like every streaming service.

Like that element was, you know,
I'm glad they explored the corroding

frustration that comes from an
artist not having financial control.

like having to be at the mercy of
someone who does not share your

creativity or passion, but just has
the fucking money that this world has

decided you need to do your creativity

Andi: Yeah.

Yeah.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Andi: It's great.

Jeremy: I mean, I guess I
have one other question here.

This movie, surprisingly not very gay.

there's nothing, nothing
really gay going on here.

Ben: No, not a particularly queer movie.

Jeremy: No.

Never really addressed.

No, no

Andi: Not, not overly,

no.

Ben: ah,

Andi: I mean

the sous chef was definitely hitting
on all the ladies just before she told

them that they were all gonna die.

But, you know, beyond that, that
was probably the queer thing in the.

Jeremy: Yeah.

She definitely reads at least a little
gay in, in her sort of limited screen.

Andi: Yeah.

Ben: I got some vibes
from the magazine editor.

Andi: Did you

Jeremy: He's the fucking worst.

Andi: He, he just seemed like a
very low brows Stanley Tuchi to me.

Ben: He struck me

Andi: Like a, A tuchi wannabe.

Jeremy: A one Chi, if you will.

Andi: Yes,

Jeremy: Sorry, Paul Adelstein.

I'm sure you're fine.

Ben: he strikes me as a man with a
very exclusionary grinder account.

Andi: the Grinder account that
he only checks on weekends.

Yeah.

Ben: Like,

Andi: then get mad.

Gets mad at anybody who messages him.

Ben: yeah, he, no, he
struck me as the guy.

Guy has like no fems, no, no
overweight people on Grindr.

Jeremy: He only checks it when

Ben: of ex

Jeremy: neighborhoods, you know.

Ben: Yeah, exactly.

Exactly.

Not because he's closet, but just
because he is just, or even not even

self-loathing, just other loathing.

Andi: Yeah.

Yeah.

Ben: That's my vibe on him.

If I'm, if I have to gra asp at
straws, which I very much am doing

Jeremy: Oh, now I know where
I've seen that actor before.

It was Leo Bergen in Scandal.

It's like the city CIA dude.

okay.

Ben: verse,

Jeremy: Yes.

He's part of the sh diverse,

Ben: the Shonda shows take place?

Like I would like to imagine that
scandal and how to get away with murder

takes place in the same universe.

And then Bridgeton is like
the prequel that takes place a

Andi: Without a doubt.

Ben: in the.

Andi: Without

Jeremy: sure.

For

sure.

Ben: I don't know if there's anything
that contradicts this, so I'm gonna

say it's like how Tarantino has his
own universe, so does Shonda Rimes.

rhymes.

Jeremy: Yeah.

I mean, if, if, you know, somebody
doesn't get away with murder, they

do get sent to the uh, you know,
hospital from Grey's Anatomy.

Okay.

So, I don't even think there's
a point in asking this at

this point, but we always do.

Uh, Would we recommend this movie.

Andi: Yes.

Ben: it.

We love this movie.

this movie is easily in my top three
best movies of last year alongside, Nope

and everything everywhere else at once.

Andi: I mean, I'm, I'm just gonna say
there, there's very few movies that I've

watched more than twice, and the fact that
I've now watched this one seven times.

Yeah.

I recommend, I highly recommend.

Jeremy: I

Ben: And I do know one of the
other ones is spirited, starring

Ryan Reynolds and Will Ferrell.

Andi: Yeah.

Yep.

Ben: That is a fun one.

And you know, I don't like Christmas
movies, but I liked Spirited.

Andi: And you know, I don't like
horror movies, but I love this one.

Ben: Yay.

So that's my recommendation.

Watch Spirited.

It has nothing to do with this movie.

Andi: But it's also just as good
as watching the menu unless like,

as long as you're looking for
Christmas cheer and like a big

old jelly something of the butt.

Ben: Ryan Reynolds is shockingly
good at dance choreography.

Andi: singing

like

Jeremy: Doesn't shock me.

Andi: who the fuck told him he could sing?

Jeremy: I assume Ryan Reynolds
is just good at everything.

He just has an ironic detachment
that makes you think he isn't.

Andi: Yeah, no,

Ben: somewhere there is a theater kid
inside Ryan Redland who's just faking it.

And he's already made it.

Andi: Yeah.

Jeremy: Did you guys have anything
else you wanted to recommend

to go along with the menu?

Ben: Uh, yes.

Andi: Burgers.

Ben: Yeah.

Smores no.

I would recommend whiplash if you
wanna see another movie about,

self destruction and creativity.

Also, JK Simmons yells at Miles
Teller, and that's a lot of.

Andi: That is a fantastic movie.

I I do enjoy it a lot.

If you're looking for something that's
more food related, but more like happy

tones somebody feeds Phil on Netflix.

Phil is the guy who fucking wrote
Seinfeld and I hate Seinfeld.

I'm, I'm, I'm just gonna throw
that right there, right out there.

don't like Seinfeld.

I find it campy and ridiculous,
but somebody feed Phil actually

makes a really authentic, wasn't.

Food show where he, he genuinely
enjoys everything that he goes to

taste, so he gets at least one.

Kudos in my book.

So there's that.

Jeremy: Awesome.

Yeah, I I have two things
I want to recommend.

One of which has absolutely nothing
to do with this, and one of which

I already mentioned, which is uh,
the bear is really good, if you can

stand it's the restaurant equivalent
of uh, it's the Adam Sand, they're

moving with the jewelry and the gems.

No, I

Andi: I have

Jeremy: of it.

Andi: idea what you're talking about.

Jeremy: Hold.

Do I get to say ? No, I
can't, I can't believe I can't

remember it all of a sudden.

It's, it was a very, like, it was
everybody's movie that they were

recommending for a minute there.

Uncut Gems, that's the name of it.

It's very, like, that's, yeah.

It's that same level of stress
of, of uncut gems just running

a restaurant running the

Ben: god fucking uncut
gems is easily one of the.

Stressful movies I've ever seen.

It was like Uncut Gems is a movie
about a guy who has dug himself into

a hole and the whole movie, people
just keep handing him ladders and

instead he just keeps digging deeper.

Andi: Yeah,

Jeremy: he's

so sure he is gonna
come out the other side.

Ben: And, And every too much are
like, take the fucking ladder.

Just climb up the fucking ladder.

And he just keeps fucking digging instead.

Andi: Yay.

Ben: It's a great movie,
but it is so stressful.

Andi: Well, thank you.

Jeremy: Yeah.

The the other thing I wanna recommend
is a new show that just showed up

on Peacock in the last couple weeks.

And it is called Poker Face.

And it is created by Ryan Johnson.

Ben: poker.

Jeremy: It is it is a mystery
show in the spirit of Colombo,

but without cops and it's stars.

Natasha Leone in the lead role as this
sort of like, she's sort of a do-gooder.

She's sort of on the run.

Like she, you know, ends up doing
detective stuff because she gets

personally involved in these stories
you know, helping people out.

And it's rather than a who done
it, it's a sort of why done it.

you know,

Ben: how, how to catch him.

Jeremy: Yeah, I'll catch

Ben: Like

Yeah, it's, I gotta say uh,
Natasha Leon is Peter Falk.

Gotta be one of my favorite genders.

Jeremy: yeah we're in like Leona Saint
because between this and Rush Doll she's

just fucking knocking him out of the park.

Like there's, there's no actor
that I could say like I love more

right now than what she is doing.

Very much, very much.

Found a way to like be her
real fucking weird self in

Ben: I love Natasha Leon's career because
it's just an inevitable transformation

of her becoming Jackie Mason.

And it's beautiful to watch.

It, it's beautiful.

It's wonderful watching Natasha
Leon become an elderly Jewish man.

Andi: That's fair.

Ben: I very much second that
poker face recommendation.

It is a wonderful show.

Jeremy: Yeah.

And I love me Ryan Johnson.

Glass Onion and fucking Glass Jedi
and Knives Out are all amazing movies.

Brick is still fucking weird.

I'm gonna have to sit down and
watch that again at some point

cause it's his first movie and that
uh, that was a weird ass movie.

But it's, it's this uh, just like
Natasha and it's a great trajectory

where you could see how all these
things lead to the next thing.

So yeah, check that out.

It's on Peacock.

There's like six or seven
episodes of it out now.

It's good stuff.

I think that does it for us.

Ben: That's

Jeremy: Andy, do you wanna let anybody
know where they can find you online?

, you don't

Andi: Yeah.

Okay, so.

The website is currently
down, but you can still find

previous episodes of my podcast.

On Anywhere You Stream podcast,
just look up Wound Up Wino and

you'll find my absolute nonsense.

New episodes will be coming in the
next month or two, depends on how

quickly I finish reading a whole
bunch of stuff and blah blah bullshit.

But beyond that you can also
follow my random, random art

adventures just by hanging up my
Instagram at Andy Ridonculous,

a n d i w r e d o n k u l u s.

And then you will see me put
a whole bunch of nonsense.

of glittery bullshit up in the world.

So that's, that's me.

That's, that's what I do these days.

I drink wine, I make
glitter art, I talk shit.

I am.

Jeremy: Uh, Well, we
look forward to all that.

And uh, as for the rest of us you
can find Emily uh, who is not here

today, but we, you can find at Mega
Moth on Twitter at mega underscore

moth on Instagram and mega moth.net.

Ben is on twitter ben the com, and
on their website@benconcomics.com,

where you can pick up all of their
books, including pre-ordering.

L Campbell wins their weekend, their
debut middle grade novel from Scholastic.

And finally for me, you can find me
on Twitter and Instagram at j Rome 58

and on my website@jeremywhitley.com
where you can check out everything I

write, including pre-ordering the dog
night, the new graphic novel I am doing

with Bree Indigo is coming this May.

Super excited about that.

You guys are gonna love it.

And of course the podcast is on Patreon
It progressively horrified on our

website@progressivelyhorrifiedtransistor.fm
and on Twitter at Prague Horror Pod

where we would love to hear from you.

And while you're talking to
us, we would love for you to go

ahead and review the podcast.

Five Stars helps more listeners
find us, and uh, we just get

bigger and more exciting.

Thanks again to Andy for joining us.

It was such a ball having you.

This was a fun movie to.

Andi: No, thank you for letting
me join y'all, and if anybody has

any other restaurant questions
that they'd like to ask.

Hunt me down on the internet.

I'll answer them.

Jeremy: Nice.

Ben: Yes.

Thank you so, so much for
joining us today, Andy.

This was a blast having you on today.

Andi: No, this is so much fun.

Thank you guys so much.

Jeremy: And uh, thanks as always
to Ben for hosting with me, and

thanks to all of you for listening.

And until next time, stay horrified.