Alicia: Hey, just a heads up the episode.

You're about to listen to a
shutter directed by a Banjong

Pisanthanakun and Parkpoom Wongpoom.

Some relevant trigger warnings
for this movie include an intense

scene of traumatic sexual assault.

Several often graphic depictions
of suicide and attempted suicide,

intense jump scares, dental
trauma, and automobile accidents.

And our hosts.

Frank, this movie is terrible.

If you'd like to learn more
about the movie, discuss this

evening, please visit our website.

Progressively horrified.transistor.fm
for show notes, relevant links

and transcripts of each episode.

After the spooky music.

We'll talk about the episode in full.

So be forewarned.

There will be spoilers.

Now let's get on with the show.

Jeremy: Good evening and welcome to
Progressively Horrified the podcast

where we hold horror to progressive
standards it never agreed to.

Tonight we're talking about an independent
Thai film, which feels like the template

for two thousands horror films altogether.

It's Shutter.

I am your host, Jeremy Whitley.

And with me tonight, I have a
panel of cinephiles and cinabites.

First they're here to invade
your house and find queer content

and all your favorite movies.

My co-host and comic
book writer, Ben Kahn.

Ben, how are you tonight?

Ben: This truly is the platonic ideal
of a horror movies until it's the most

upsetting thing we've ever watched.

Jeremy: Indeed.

And we picked her up at the
spooky crossroads of anime

and sexy monster media.

It's co-host and comics artist, Emily
Martin, how are you tonight, Emily?

Emily: I'm not feeling
sorry for this protagonist.

never

Ben: Not even a little bit.

Fuck this guy.

Emily: Even for somebody who's so
incredibly aware of how haunted they are.

Like he's just basically
asking to be fucked with.

I've been haunted for years.

Maybe I'll just go everywhere slowly
and creepily, and then just go in the

darkest creepiest place as possible.

I mean, I guess it's a
good conversation topic.

I don't know.

Jeremy: IMDV says a young photographer
and his girlfriend discover mysterious

shadows in the photographs after
a tragic accident, they soon learn

that they can not escape their past.

Just a note, if you
were watching a little.

There are several movies called
shutter, including an American

remake of this movie from 2008.

And you're looking for the 2004 one
a, which is Thai with subtitles.

the only place I could find
it was on Hoodoo for free.

It is a 480 P uh, so if you have a
big TV, even the subtitles are blurry.

Ben: I did not know that distinction.

So I guess we should talk about the
first 10 minutes of the 2008 movie.

Wow, sure.

It was crazy when Joshua Jackson and
Trish Walker from Jessica Jones hit

that lady and then the movie ended.

Jeremy: Yeah, that's true.

It was PC.

Ben: Yeah, if I can have a Pacey,
they had a wedding, they hit

a lady and then I don't know.

I stopped watching

Emily: and the curse this time
doesn't have to do with the wedding.

Jeremy: So there is a wedding.

The wedding is actually before
the movie starts, which is an

interesting, an interesting way
to start to jump into a movie.

There has just been a wedding.

Ben: Yeah.

You know what?

You get like an establishing shot of
like a ceremony or a party of some kind.

This is like, the party has cleared out.

It is done.

It is like the last stragglers.

Like it is like they are
flicking the lights on and off

last call has come and gone.

Emily: Yeah.

That's a pretty aesthetic
banquet hall though.

Like the setting, the colors of the,
all of that stuff was fucking awesome.

Ben: And they married there.

If marriage wasn't a complete
fucking money pit of a scam,

fuck the marriage industry.

I'm not spending fucking
five grand on invitations.

Get the fuck outta here.

Wedding industry.

Emily: Fair.

Jeremy: So one of our four friends
or media is clearly loaded.

He has a very nice wedding
hall that they're set up at.

This will be, this is a little
difficult because our, so there are,

Ben: these characters are going
to be tough to talk about.

Jeremy: Yeah.

There are four characters four
friends, two of them do not matter.

Like in the plot they do not matter.

Ben: yeah.

Is no need to get odd screen deaths.

It's just gone.

Emily: I don't think they have names.

Jeremy: I, they do in the
credits, but I don't remember any

of them from the actual movie.

So, didn't think it was worth.

Going through all of this, but the
two care, the three characters that

matter in this scene that we'll see
in the rest of the movie are Ton,

who was the guy getting married?

He's kind of a shit he'll even here
after he's just gotten married.

We'll find out he's much
worse than that later.

Yeah.

My

Ben: first thought was like, oh, the
rare misogynist shit, head wife guy.

And then it's no, he's the worst

Jeremy: guy.

And then we'll, we'll find out.

We find that in this first scene
that he just got married and it

was also apparently out as they
put it in the movie whoring with

his best friend the night before.

So there's that I don't know exactly
what the verbiage that they use in Thai

is, but the way it's translated in the
subtitles is they were out whoring.

We also then have Tun or is it Tune?

I'm a little unsure.

Who is easily, the like
better of these four friends.

He is more reticent to be an asshole.

Ben: Well, he's the handsomest.

So that's how we know he's the
best and most important one.

Yeah.

Jeremy: He really seems like he's being
dragged along to this whole situation.

And then his girlfriend Jane, who is
clear, they, the designated driver.

Cause she is not pounding
shots with the rest of them.

Ben: Thank God.

I did know, I did write that in my notes
when I saw the driving and that she was

behind the wheel, I'm like, okay, good.

You didn't have the clearly
drunk person doing it.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Because then the first thing that
was getting a little irritated, I was

like, oh, so like the girl, that's
going to be the girl in the movie.

Doesn't get to drink, but everybody else.

And I was like, oh no, she's driving.

Okay.

That's fine.

That's smart.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Jane is the girlfriend of ton.

She's, she's staying sober and
listening to all of their bullshit.

Jane is driving Tunhome from this.

He is still sort of drunk and hitting
on her and flirting with her and

distracting her while she's driving.

And she, turns back from flirting with
him just in time to see a girl just

before she hits her and runs Rover.

And then seems like she's in
a car chase in fast and the

furious and crashes into a sign.

Emily: Um, This is the longest swerve.

In car crashes.

Yes.

Time slows down when you're going
through something like that.

Which I think is a cool
decision cinema graphics.

Ben: Oh, oh, in the movie I tell
you about in real life car crashes,

just like real life slows down.

I'm like, yeah, that was pretty
cool of evolution to do that.

Give you a little more reaction time.

Thanks, adrenal gland.

Thanks early.

You're good for looking at.

Emily: I mean, yeah.

I mean, that's what it feels
like, and that's why I liked it.

You know, like I gave the movie
bet benefit of the doubt, I

guess, for that exceptionally long
swerved when it was not very far.

Jeremy: I think current into like
a, I guess an electric sign on the

side of the road and electronic sign.

And they, they turn and they see a body
lying on the road where they've just

left and tun being the great guy that
he is convinces Jane to take off and

leave the girl lying in the road behind.

And then the next day just goes to work.

Like it's all fine.

Yep.

Ben: If Tony wasn't already cursed him,
just abandoning a hit and run, that

gets you a curse all on its own curse.

If you weren't already cursed.

Jeremy: At this point, I thought it was,
I thought this movie was going to be,

and I know what you did last summer.

Emily: Oh yeah.

Yeah.

And that's like the whole setup.

And that's why I, For a long time in
this movie, I thought that's what it was.

And it was just about like, okay,
well they're haunted because they

did a hit and run and then it
becomes so much more than that.

And I really appreciate
that about the film.

Some things they linger on that
I don't appreciate, but we'll

get there.

Ben: Yeah.

This movie excels at creating a
really disturbing creepy atmosphere.

This movie is affectively actually scary
in a way horror movies rarely achieve.

And it just feels like, again, I call it
that a platonic ideal and it really does.

It feels like what you want, like the tone
of it and the atmosphere it builds and

the scares it brings feels like what you
want out of a prototypical horror movie.

Emily: Totally.

And you have a lot of a lot of archetypes
and you have a lot of the, uh, the

visual language, you know, we have
the photos and you know, the photos.

Ben: Yeah.

Well this movie actually at the very end.

Emily: I mean, it's called shutter.

Ben: This isn't about a ghost
to only lives in like curtains.

Emily: Yeah,

Jeremy: no, I think, um, I mean, it
feels very much of its time in some ways

it's very, it's definitely a post to
Ringu or a movie, um, has a lot of the

same, the same tricks that Ringu does.

Well, I think being still distinct
enough that like, it doesn't

just feel like you're reliving
another remake of that moving

Ben: And again, I haven't seen Ringu
so I might be missing some influences

and themes from it, but this movie
felt very much like the Ringu with some

real elements of um, silent hill tale.

Emily: Yeah.

Well, I think those are also
kind of interrelated, right?

Like you have the silent hill,
when did silent hill to come out.

It was after Ringu.

Jeremy: I don't know the answer to that.

Ben: I believe.

Jeremy: 98, I think.

And Ringu

Ben: 1998.

Emily: Yeah.

You know, that visual vocabulary is
definitely a couple steps from each other.

It's definitely an intermingled.

But what this movie does is that it
takes the uh, the imagery to another

symbolic level, because with Ringu you
have a lot of that imagery of the girl

and her reared, like haunting styles,
the hair, then walking upside down and

backwards and all this kind of stuff,
which apparently I was very effective.

Cause ever since Ringu, everybody's been
all about that girl coming out of the TV

Ben: yeah.

I'm fucking creeped out.

Every time we get a Ringu mean ghost
every time hear it's super effective.

Like, the strain of horror influenced.

I feel like it has.

honestly, it goes back legitimately
centuries, this sense of photography being

a gateway to another world a viewpoint
which captures that, which is there.

But the, I can't say, I mean,
just modern and stuff like that.

You have the whole fatal frame
series archive, 81 on Netflix.

Which spoilers.

That will be my recommendation.

If you like this a.

It does go back to a cold, the stuff
where like fucking rich ass, 1890s

people obsessed with Alistair Crowley
and shit would take photographs and

be like, Ooh, a spot on the photo.

That has to be a ghost.

You guys,

Emily: yeah.

Spirit photography was pretty easy
to do, I should say back then.

Jeremy: harder to avoid actually like
that, they talk about it in this movie,

a lot of the traditional sphere of
photography, a lot of the things we see

where, you know, we have people in photos
that aren't, shouldn't be in the photos

are a result of double exposure, uh,
which isn't really an issue with digital

photography anymore, but was, you know,
much more common when there was an issue

when there was a possibility of taking a
photo on the same, you know, frame twice.

Emily: Yeah.

Ben: We do also see how digital
photography though is super easy to

manipulate and then fake ghost and
stuff, which also leads to one of my

favorite moments in the movie is when
the guy at the spirit photo magazine

said, it's like, we're legit operation.

We have our permits, which
just makes me go, hold on.

Are there illegal, like
ghost photo magazines

Emily: in title?

there's probably like independent
ones that don't have permits.

You know, the paperwork

Ben: you have to fill out to be an
officially licensed ghost magazine.

Emily: I would be, uh, we're
on Twitter, ProgHorrorPod.

If you know about the, uh, the
process to legitimize your ghost

magazines, anywhere, really

Ben: lawyers out there who listened
to our pipe test and specialize in

the legal field behind publishing
and or paranormal exposure,

Emily: But yeah, this movie does
like, actually talk about photography

as opposed to other films, which
kind of just use it as a gimmick.

I was interested to see that there
was like actually explored it.

And as somebody who has studied
photography and, and worked with

enlargers and stuff there is some
interesting stuff to be found here.

at

Jeremy: this next scene is where we get
sort of our first instance of that stuff.

So a tendons out taking
pictures for this graduation.

And he is, you know, looking through
his camera and thinks he sees a dead

girl amongst the people on the stage.

I mean, you know, it looks not through
the camera, there's nobody there.

And so he shakes it off and
goes on about his business.

Jean meanwhile has not been sleeping
since the accident and can't believe

is fine to just go out and live his
life after they've run over a girl.

Uh, and then when all of the times
pictures come back, they have weird

bright spots and light lines and them.

And then one of them shows like a,
an actual face of the girl in the

shadow of one of the other people
on the stage for the graduation.

Ben: I do have to say maybe this is
because I was a little tired and out of

it watching the beginning of this movie,
maybe just because stone is so fucking

casual, I legit forgot about the person
they ran over like a minute before.

And I wasn't sure why Jane was so upset.

And then she's like the person
we ran over, I was like,

oh my God, fucking right.

Yeah, shit.

Get your head in the game, man.

What the fuck?

Emily: And it's very awkward because
at first like, Tun it's just confused.

So

Jeremy: here's the, he just
has a weird pain in his neck.

That's all that.

That's all that's wrong with.

Tun is his neck hurts and he did

Emily: hit his head
when they were swerving.

Like he did hit his head against
the window, which cracked a window.

Jeremy: They do go back to the site.

I was a little confused at this point,
cause it turned out it was the next day.

And they were like, was there
was an accident here last night?

What happened?

And the guy directing traffic, he's
like, oh no, that somebody hit the sign.

That's all signs networking.

Uh, so you know, they got me out here
and they're like, there was nobody

hurt in this accident, are you sure?

And the man's like, no,
there was nobody hurt.

What, what are you talking about?

And they're like, all right, I guess.

And so they go about their lives and they
start having a series of creepy visions

and weird things happening to them.

Eric girl, Jane sees a creepy girl
climbing out of the sink in the,

uh, black room, which was, that was
a real creepy bit because they're

very specifically showing that it's
the sink and there's nowhere that

this body could be, but she is still
slowly pushing up out of the sink.

Ben: This movie is a very effective
at creating creepy, disturbing,

unsettling imagery and jump scares.

And yeah, dark rooms are just
some very scary, very good, scary

setting, dark rooms, cause it's all

Emily: red.

And then.

You're like looking at photos and
it's kinda hard to see, you know,

Ben: I'm not sure why he
keeps going to the print shop

if he has his own dark room.

But I also don't know
anything about photography.

So who the fuck gives a shit?

If I'm confused,

Emily: You can't process color
photos in a dark room because the

red light will affect the exposure.

So in order to process color photos,
you need like complete blackness of

Ben: learning things.

Emily: but that's the thing that's
hilarious to me is I'm like what

kind of fucking photographer
doesn't check his negatives.

Like, he's a photographer.

Like he's a professional.

We see him doing wedding photography.

We see him doing the photography
at the, at the graduation.

so he gives his negatives over to the
guy at the, um, the, the print shop.

And he's like, oh, you're Your
equipment's fucked up because it's

got like, look at all these artifacts.

Ben: I love how indignant
this shopkeeper is.

Right?

It's like they come out good.

It's cause you're such
a great photographer.

They come out bad.

It's cause I fucked up developing now.

I see how it is.

You check the negative
check the fucking negatives.

You're a piece of shit.

The one

Emily: of the first times in a
film that I've seen them actually

check the fucking negatives.

Ben: I loved it.

I loved how fucking like don't you
dare don't you dare put this on me.

Well, and the shopkeeper MVP of the movie.

Emily: Like, he's developing negatives
at his house, I assume because

he has all the negatives there.

Oh, so

Jeremy: he has yes, converted his bathroom
and to his dark room, the toilet is

behind a curtain in the dark room and
everything else is just going on in what

appears to be the sink in the bathroom.

Ben: That might be the scariest
thing I'd ever go through.

Just like pooping in a darkroom.

That'd be terrifying.

I just know I was getting
into I'm like I'm eight.

When am I ever finding
myself in a dark room?

B if there's a toilet in the dark room,
what the fuck have I gotten myself into?

I'm definitely not making
it out alive though.

Emily: So his negatives are bad.

First of all, there's a reason
that you have the red light in the

dark room because natural light and
bright light interrupts the process.

So if he's having his door open
constantly, while he is doing developing

process and the, uh, in the bathroom,
of course, as negatives are gonna

have fucking artifacts all over them.

Jeremy: And he kinda a real well sunny
lit apartment on the other side of

that door and people are constantly
just coming in and out of it.

so we, we see the photos as they come back
and they've got like bunch of shiny spots,

blurs, every people's faces, you know, we
see the one picture of the girl in there.

Ben: People would pay good money
for that kind of filter nowadays.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Ben: What are you face filter?

Oh yeah.

I'll be like Dick Grayson, Inspiral
shoes, your shoes, your shoes.

That's a very obscure comic joke.

Emily: There's a spiral
is here's a new samaki

Ben: no, that was where my spy comic
Grayson, which is really cool and fun.

Emily: I believe.

Ben: Okay.

And yes, based swirling technology.

Jeremy: Yeah.

So, uh, tell also has a dream
people keep having these weird

visions and then they wake up.

It's not clear that anybody ever goes
to sleep, but they keep waking up

after having horrible things happen.

I, his dream where he goes to like pick
up Jane at school and she's the only one

in this spooky, mostly empty classroom.

And then like, he goes to, he grabs
her by the shoulder and she turns

around and spits out blood and teeth.

And it was pretty disturbing
and he jumped and he wakes

Ben: up these moments are great, but it
does get a little frustrating at that

point in the movie when the intense thing
that it seems like it's going to kick the

movie into the next gear, keeps me in a

Emily: dream.

Yeah.

And nobody's talking about it to each
other, like Jane is upset and tone is

upset and they're both upset and they're
not talking to each other about like being

obviously haunted and so well kind of

has

Jeremy: already, basically the
horror movie boyfriend shut her down.

Like she, that there is some,
we hit a person and now creepy

shit is happening to us.

And he's like, oh, don't
make this a big thing.

yeah.

And then, you know, he, he's
just having neck problems,

which are clearly unrelated.

Um, and when he goes to get those checked
out, there's nothing wrong with his neck.

I'd

Ben: call him a chip at that.

Doesn't even begin to
describe just how awful tone

Emily: is.

He's a, he's not a champion.

He's like.

Ben: Peace ease the whole damn cookie.

And it's not a good cookie, big

Emily: turd, cookie

Ben: shit, big old shit cookie.

Emily: And he has a spooky
puppet in his apartment.

So come on, dude, like you're
just asking to be haunted.

You're a spooky photographer.

You are in denial constantly.

You've got spooky puppets everywhere.

Ben: God I had in my notes
during the bathroom scene,

it's like, Ooh, crazy door.

Nah, what'd you got crazy during
this little weird, funny decision.

And then you get to the end of the movie,
it's like, oh no, this was explained.

And now it's very
disturbing and terrifying.

Emily: Yeah.

I mean, this is an example of
why you should communicate.

but yeah, like he's, he's shut
Jane down and she's like looking

at the photos and she's like, this
is obviously like some's going on.

And so she looks up the, uh, the spirit
photographers and she spawns the magazine

and they go to the magazine office,

Ben: Yeah, I'm scared.

We got the photo in the
head turning to face him.

Emily: you know, that's another thing
that is interesting because a lot of

the quote-unquote spirit photography
that you see is just an example of

para dolia, which is that where you
recognize faces no matter what, because

that's how our brains are wired.

Ben: Yeah, a lot of it's like,
look, there's Jesus and my

Emily: Doritos.

And, and they also talk about like,
when he talks to the, the shop owner,

he talks about double exposures any
shows the uh, the shop owner shows

his double exposures that, you know,
show the ghostly image of somebody

Jeremy: Yeah.

And when they go to the tabloid,
they see a guy manufacturing

one digitally, and then they're
like, oh, this is all bullshit.

And they pass them up to the editor
of this paper and he's like, oh

no, it's really easy to make.

It's real easy to do this stuff.

I mean, the people love it.

So we run a more than we
actually get photos like this.

And they're like, oh wait,
they're not all bullshit.

And he pulls out his special binder
of real real ghost photos and

started showing them off to them.

And he's, you know, it's a

Ben: lot of times

Jeremy: they're related to somebody
who's in the picture, there's something

going on where, you know, they, they
haven't been able to leave a loved one

behind they're attached to them somehow.

So they're, you know, stuck
here dealing with that.

Ben: I remember that every or
clinging to them, remember this

very carefully selected wordage.

Emily: Yeah.

Cause we're not doing
spoilers I guess yet.

One of the things that the guy that
the, uh, editor in chief explains is

it, oh, well Polaroids, one of the most,

Ben: you can't fake a polo roll,

Emily: liable photographic
development methods.

Ben: I think he's saying like the bite
it out, it comes, I think you're saying

Jeremy: you can't have somebody,
somebody digitally altered

depolarize you can't say that.

Oh, you know, the guy at
the shop is fucking with me.

You know, it has to be something that,
you know, shows up almost immediately

for you and you can see, which is a
great idea, which I wish they'd done

more within this show the two times
or in this movie, the two times they

use it is done exceedingly well.

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: So, you know, maybe it's better
that they don't do it more, but the

two scenes in here with it are great.

Ben: Oh, pull up the Polaroid.

Jeremy: So Jane then discovers that all
of these photos where there's like light

bleeding over people's faces, all, no
light seems to be coming from one place.

There's like one room in the school
behind them, which the light is

concentrated on and then shining
out of and fucking up these pills.

Ben: We can forget the very important
metaphor we have here of mantis sex.

Just fucking man.

We got a lot of mantis
imagery in this movie.

Yeah.

Emily: There's a lot of
after dark mantis porn.

You know, this movie

Ben: once you think about
mantises and how they fuck, even

though they kill while fucking

Emily: to share, it's late
to it as grasshoppers.

No Sergeant grasshopper

Ben: at first, I was like, okay, movie.

That's interesting.

And then they're driving by and just cool.

It was like this fucking
closeup on a mantis.

And I'm like, ah, okay,
you're you're doing a thing.

This is imagery now.

Emily: yeah.

Of the mantis fucking on the
screen while he's uh, like working

on his photos and getting upset.

I think that was very much like, yes,
this is a thing, remember the mantis shot.

Remember the

Ben: mantis?

M D

Jeremy: yeah.

So one of the best scenes in this movie is
the next one where Jane decides that she's

going to go investigate this classroom
that all of this light is focusing on.

So she goes up to the classroom,
taking her Polaroid camera with her

and she decided she she's going to
take pictures around there and find the

ghost that's clearly in there somewhere.

Emily: Before this happened, that
was the hospital scene, which is

important because they take the
x-rays and nothing's wrong with them.

His neck has been hurting.

They all, so he's a lot,

Ben: he be way more than he should.

Emily: Yeah.

He weighs about twice
as much as he should.

Oh, and the nurse that he keeps hearing
the nurse calling him a lying bastard.

Yeah, sharing what's actually happening.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Cause that's definitely not
the nurse's voice either.

It's a different voice.

It seems to be coming from her.

Yeah.

You're calling the lying bastard.

Okay.

So Jane is in this class, this
biology lab full of weird specimens

and stuff and is, you know, taking
pictures with the Polaroid and laying

them down on the ground, trying to,
you know, piece together where this

ghost is and finds the image of
the ghost up against the wall here.

And at that point, like some paranormal
activity stuff starts happening and

things start shaking and all the
vitals and stuff were moving around.

And then, uh, like, uh, there's, you
know, ghost shouting and rushing at her.

And then a portrait falls off the
wall of a student that was there.

Whose whose name is nature?

Natre.

Natre.

And she's a girl who's receiving.

Ben: I have a question word.

What class is taught in this room?

Emily: This is a, This is

Ben: a photography room.

Is this like a biologic biology sample

Emily: room?

This is the biology sample room
because they mentioned earlier that

a bunch of people are science majors.

when they're taking photographs
of them, they're taking them in

front of the science building.

And so they, they mentioned that they're
science majors, but I'm pretty sure this

is a storage room for specimens because
there is no place for people to sit here.

It

Ben: seems like, I think I was
also seemed to be the photo studio

room and I was just the sunlight.

Is that what everyone's
got their own photo major?

I was like, this is it.

You all have to take the
photo, the jar animal photos.

This is

Emily: everyone's final project,
a photo studio in every classroom.

So you can

Jeremy: teach your gamma Delta.

Yes.

Dead animals.

Ben: I went to U Penn.

We, well, we all went to the
fucking like Nutter museum of

like medical abnormalities.

I don't know.

What's fucking normal.

Emily: That's a good, that's a good point.

I mean, this room is really
cool aesthetic as fuck.

And this ghost, you know, she's a
science major because she doesn't

break any of the specimen jars.

Yep.

Jeremy: She brings a very little in this.

The only thing she really breaks this,
this photograph of Natre who is Jean goes

to investigate this girl and finds tons.

What appears to be tons, a yearbook,
I think to look up pictures of her.

Well, it seems that she's chosen the right
place because tun has pictures of her.

And.

he is with her and photos.

She is clearly went to school with him.

Meanwhile Tunhas got a visit from his
friend, Tonn who, you know, we saw

get married at the beginning, who is
frantic about finding those photos.

What's nowhere he's hitting them.

And so he's digging through all of his
top photography is absolutely out of

his mind, freaks out a Tunis trying
to like calm him down and, you know,

steps out of the room for a second.

When he comes back on has gone.

And he goes to track down Ton, he
goes back to Ton's apartment just

in time to see a ton, just step
onto the edge of his balcony and

take a leap right off the building

Emily: onto somebody's car with
someone still in the car, which

Jeremy: is somebody who's just
appears to be just pulling

into the space as, you know,

Ben: stay has been absolutely ruined.

Emily: Oh my God.

A few people's they've spent.

Ben: No, but if I'm being honest,
the person I have the most

empathy for is that car owner.

Oh yeah.

Emily: Ton,

Ben: Ton.

I have

Emily: no sympathy for, I also
have no sympathy for time.

The law, the more you trust,
the more near he gets no

Ben: sympathy, a little sympathy for the
wife, but also relief for her because

now she doesn't have to be married.

So that feels like a win for her.

The one person who's just taken
a total L and is completely

innocent, is that car owner.

Jeremy: we don't know if maybe they
have another curse situation going on.

I mean, as we discussed with that,

Ben: these movies all take
place at the same universe.

And this is just a world where like
what out of every eight people.

I just like dealing with a
fucker said any given time

Emily: you saw the number of spiritful
Polaroids that were on that wall.

Like, come on.

That's like half the population.

It just have a fucking, I mean, like
if you think about it don't actually,

because I don't think it's actually
half the population, but there was

a shit Tonnof spirit photographs.

Certainly many of

them

Jeremy: were lots of people being
cursed and haunted and everything.

So, Jane finds

Ben: Ghostbusters,

Emily: Y you don't see the,

Ben: this, these kinds of
fucking curses, a new yard.

Cause we busted them.

We busted the doses to go

Emily: sees,

Jeremy: and we, we still don't.

I mean, honestly, we still don't
know what's going on at this point.

And it's not until like this next scene
where tun is sitting there crying about

his friend, like at the scene of his
suicide, gene shows up and then Ton's

wife shows up and is like, oh, this is
all the fault of you and your shitty

little group of friends everybody's dying.

That's why.

And he's like, what do you
mean everybody's dying?

And she's like, yeah, your
other two friends are dead.

They committed suicide in
the last couple of days.

Did you not know about

Ben: this?

Did not know about this did not.

I like they were not close enough
that he was on the text chain.

There has

Jeremy: been a whole other ghost
movie going on during this movie

that we do not know about two
people have already committed

suicide and died because of a ghost.

And we didn't see any of that.

Ben: This movie is very
successful at being creepy.

And psychologically disturbing and
putting you at extreme unease without

needing to rely heavily on goer.

It does employ jump scares more than
other psychological harbors might.

But I do think what this moot, this movie
should be commended for the scares that

is able to achieve through atmospheres,
cinematography, setting, lighting, and

just the creativity of the scenario.

Jeremy: I think this twist has done
brilliantly because we get all the

pieces of it sort of at the same time,
without knowing that we're getting

pieces of it at the same time, because
Jane is investigating this, you know,

ghost at the school, and then there's
dead girl a while this stuff between

tun and Tonnis going on and shit.

And, uh, you know, when she shows
up to, uh, to Ton's apartment,

like she's ready to figure out
what's going on with this girl.

And, uh, it turns out that
story is already halfway done.

Like, you know, two, two of
the guys have already died.

This is the third guy.

He's the only one left.

At which point she is like,
Hey, who the fuck is this?

And what's going on?

And they have to like stop in the car to
have this conversation about who Natre is.

And in what it is, that's going
like, what happened to her?

And time gives this story that
like, oh, she was this weird girl

that they went to school with.

And his shitty friends used to make
fun of her, but he thought she was

kind of cute and started dating her.

But because he had these shitty friends
that were making in front of her, decided

that they needed to keep it on the DL
and they weren't going to talk about it.

And he was going to, you know,
not tell anybody to the point that

like she gets on an elevator with
a group of them at one point and

the other three are harassing her.

And he doesn't say anything.

He just sits in the corner and
like laughs along with them.

Ben: It is such a piece of shit.

And this is his version of events that
is supposed to make him look good.

His like innocent explanation
is essentially him going.

All I said was will no unwritten me
of this turbulent college girlfriend.

Yeah.

Jeremy: Cause after, after he is
terrible to her she like confront

him and he's like, well, I guess
we're just not going to be, I guess

we're just not going to date anymore.

Cause that's the alternative to like
actually fessing up to being a shithead

you know, and changing my ways.

So I'm going to dump you as to
which her response is, and this

is never the right response.

Just to put it out there,
then I'm going to kill myself.

And he doesn't-

Ben: That's not, that's not an
acceptable response to a breakup ever.

Emily: And it is equally not cool to
treat that that response, no matter, where

it's coming from, cause I mean, that
kind of response is evidence of some, uh,

mental condition that should be treated

Ben: yes.

A hundred percent.

Emily: But when is like talking
about this to Jane, he's like,

oh yeah, we thought it was funny.

I was just like, and

Ben: that was just something.

No, not what, yeah.

Tunis a terrible person who deserves the
fate worse than death that befalls him.

Jeremy: Yeah.

At this point, you think, well, I guess
he was the good one of the group, but

he's still kind of shitty, of course,
you know, bad things are happening to

him now and it will, it will get worse.

Ben: So it will get worse.

Emily: I don't care if you were just
following orders is still just as

Jeremy: bad.

So he says that, after.

She threatened to commit suicide.

If he left her, even told his
friends about it and Tonnsaid

he would take care of it.

And then Tun doesn't know
what happened after that.

And Todd not bothered to investigate,
but he never saw an Autry

Emily: again.

At this point,

Ben: that's the version of events
that's supposed to make him look good.

Oh, my total massaging, his shit had
best friends said he'd take care of it.

And then she just dropped out
of school and disappeared.

I never asked any questions.

I'm like, that's what you're going with.

That's your defense.

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: okay.

So you want to talk
about the bathroom scare?

Yes.

Ben: this is actually a false scare where
10 is in to you and is in the bathroom

having himself a good, all smoke in a
poo, good old cigarette in the bathroom.

We've all been there.

I'm sure.

And

Emily: oh, I was going to say I haven't
been there, but I haven't been anywhere.

I haven't smoked anywhere where
you have an Ash tray built into

the toilet paper dispenser.

Notably,

Jeremy: at this

Ben: point he is in the bowling
alley is what you're telling me.

No

Jeremy: at the county as well aware of the
fact that he is being haunted by something

that has killed three of his friends
and decides to go to a public restroom

alone and have a, have a poo and a smoke,

Ben: just go to a secluded public
restroom alone, a setting where nothing

bad has ever happened in a horror movie.

Emily: And then he looks into the
mirror and he's like Candyman, Candyman.

Ben: So he sees there's no toilet
paper where he goes to wipe wage,

a rookie mistake, always check the
toilet paper supply before you sit

Emily: down.

I mean, you're haunted.

I gave you were distracted.

However, yeah.

So

Ben: he asked for a roll of toilet paper
from the next style, a fly as hell.

Woman gives us a paper,
gives him a TP roll

Jeremy: so I can reach it under in
this men's restroom with very well.

Ben: Yeah.

Yeah.

So he thinks it's the ghost.

So he rushes out of there.

He's pulled his pants up.

He has not wiped.

Does he spend the rest of this
fucking scene freaking out with

just like, but for like an unripe.

Probably, I mean, he searches it does
I'm protagonists just have a big old

shitty, but in this scene, shit, cookie.

That's what I'm saying.

If you delete this entire thing, I'll

Emily: understand.

I will be upset if you do.

Ben: very important.

I know we're supposed to like talk
about progressive politics, but

real question is our main character.

Just have a big old pants full of
Dooky during this whole scene of a

Emily: movie.

okay, first of all, a 10 would
the ghost have nails on fleek

would not tra have nails on fleek.

Great nails

Ben: nails on

Jeremy: generally traditionally a long

Ben: black hair probably have

Jeremy: very gross hands, you know,

Emily: very specific nails

Ben: immaculate.

Jeremy: He kicks in this door and this
woman covers her privates and then says,

well, at least wait until I'm done.

And then he runs off and disappears.

Ben: But she, her not cursed,
no nurses on her fucking free.

She was out there living
at her best fucking life.

Jeremy: Uh, she's just starting
to use the goddamn bathroom.

That's first guy kicked in
the door and I was just doing

Ben: a solid, provide a toilet
paper to a man who did not use it.

Emily: Yeah.

And I mean, he can't go back into the,
to the bathroom after that, you know,

like that's so fucking embarrassing for
him to like it on somebody taking a shit.

And then they, and then like, she, she
took so much control of that situation.

Cause she's like, can we
wait until I'm done shitting?

And you know, so she's like, hi, uh,

Ben: and listen to her out
there who listens to our

podcast while eating dinner.

Sorry.

Emily: But the, this, yeah,
this is a bad time for tun.

Ben: Yeah.

Well it's the movie
also very much exceeded.

Where I liked the movie with its
overlying tone dreams is that it does

lean into the sleep deprivation element
and the, that is always your inevitable

gateway into real psychological horror.

And what is real what's happening?

What is Curt?

And again, I do like
that for the most part.

This is a villain who kind of operates
through fear and influence on not

just direct physical violence.

Emily: Yeah.

She like, there's a point where I
feel like the ghost is just indulging

in fucking with turn so hard.

Ben: Oh, a hundred percent.

Emily: Yeah.

And he is really like, like,
like Jeremy said, like he's like,

okay, I've, I've been haunted.

I'm turn, I'm a shitbag.

And I'm, I've been haunted.

My girlfriend knows that we're haunted.

I'm trying to fast.

But we have to get, I'm
just going to do everything.

That's possible to make it as easy
for me to be haunted and fucked with.

It has

Ben: another thing, is it it's one way
and the Weaver, it says like, if she wants

to kill me, then just fucking kill me.

You should've stuck with that pledge.

You abandoned that pledge immediately.

You were

Emily: serious about, you would leave.

Jane.

Jeremy: We started actually
said the like bathroom scare.

What I thought was the other dark
room scare we have, which is a very

under, like, it's a really undersold
scare where he is developing seven,

the dark room, and a woman walks up
next to him and starts looking at

pictures and he goes, oh, Hey Jane.

And the phone rings and he
goes, I'll be right back.

I'm going to get the phone.

He walks out and answers the phone.

Then it's Jane on the phone and he looks
back and there's nobody in the dark room.

I

Ben: love that.

I love that kind of scare.

I like that kind of like under
lighting thing, like undersold

thing, like, oh, that's great.

I love that kind of scares so

Emily: much.

Yeah.

And so that's one of the things where
I thought that his interaction with

Tonn may have been also imagined.

So because in the movie so far, like at
that point the movie is just specifically

about, they hit a girl, Jane and
turn are trying to figure that out.

They're spooky photos.

You know, who was the girl that
they hit, you know, they don't

know if she's alive or dead.

And then Tonn tone shows up randomly after
the scene where Jane also has randomly

like been there and then disappeared.

So like, it was really
kind of out of left field.

So I'm like, okay, so there's more
to this, or something's going on

with turn and, you know, at one
point I thought like, okay, so Tim

got his head bashed by the accident.

So maybe he's having some
sort of hallucinatory issue.

Because Tonn comes in and he
is, has creepily opened the door

and then just appeared in the
apartment and is ranting and raving.

Like, and it's very dark and spooky.

And then tune turns to call
somebody and then Tonn is gone.

And so, you know, at that point, I
didn't know that that was real until,

you know, we find out that Tanya has
jumped out the window onto the car.

Bringing us back up to now.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Speaking of cars, the next scene we get of
her fucking with him is there like driving

on the road and he sees her in the back.

Way back behind the car.

So he decides to speed up and drive away.

At which point she starts
floating alongside to the car.

Ben: that's the one thing that made
me like giggle more than like I

was scared was I'm assuming over

Jeremy: looking over at Jane and
she's like crawling sideways,

looking at him through the window.

Emily: It reminds me of that
key and Peele sketch where

they're all like college bros.

And then they were like being
haunted by the one goats

Jeremy: that's to like, he decided
the best way to deal with this ghost

is to drive 140 kilometers per hour.

Ben: Um, and how to speed.

This goes, which is, oh, some
real dumb thereto energy.

Jeremy: Yeah.

And at which point I'm going to, outrace

Ben: the ghost

Jeremy: you look.

So he looks over to see if the
ghost is still in Jane's window.

She's not, he turns back forward
and she's climbing across the

front of the car, looking at him.

Ben: I got that one got me
that one, I jumped at that one

Jeremy: got, and he, he hits the
brakes and has another very long stop.

But does not, there's not a full on
crash or run anybody over this time.

And I think this is the breaking point
at which they decide, we actually need

to figure out what to do about this guy.

Emily: Yeah.

And I think that they were
there at the crossroads.

Sticking it out to find the ghost
and then they find the ghost and

he's like, oh fuck the ghost.

I'm out.

And Jane's like,

Jeremy: okay.

Yeah.

And intelligent, any of what's
going on, she doesn't see the ghost.

Emily: It's just, and she just
like, oh, you're driving crazy.

This is great.

I feel safe.

Just kidding.

And finally

Jeremy: ended like we should go figure
out what's up with natury and why

all of this weird shit is going on.

And so they, they drive again.

This is, there's a lot of similarities
between this and, uh, our other

curse movie from a few weeks
ago, they go out to the country

to find this this girl's house.

They find her mom who is
immediately off-putting.

She is like, oh, you're Natre's friends.

Kamin, come hang out
with me, come see Natre.

We don't actually know if non tree's dead
at this point, but she has been haunting

people, which seems like a dead giveaway.

And so like,

Ben: I see what you did there.

Jeremy: She brings them in and
sits down and she's like, oh,

I'm going to get you some tea.

Ben: And I'm making not tray's
favorite dinner tonight.

She's just

Emily: resting.

She's like, I'm going to wake her

Jeremy: up.

He's resting upstairs.

Let me go get some tea.

And they're like, well, let's go fucking
upstairs and see what Natre is doing.

I don't know what's going on with
all the bottles up here, but there

are bottles on top of bottles on
top of bottles in there and they.

You know, they, they go into investigate.

Uh, what's up with Nazri.

I

Ben: don't know what the battles are

Emily: for the bottles
are Jeremy continued?

Well,

Jeremy: she is straight
up mummified in her bed.

Emily: They are preservatives.

Ben: Aaaaahhhhhhh.

Jeremy: She is very good in her bed.

Super good.

Oh, this is bad.

And the mom's like, what
are you doing up here?

You very rude people.

And they're like, see, the thing is
your daughter's been haunting us.

She's been showing up everywhere.

She's clearly not resting in peace.

So maybe we should get her cremated
because we're definitely her

friends and that's definitely all.

But she's been showing up around campus.

So we just wanted to take it
upon ourselves to investigate

Ben: this.

I'm always fascinated by different
burial rituals and how sometimes there

are some cultures, very old rituals are
just totally contradictory of others.

Like coming.

Like I come from a.

Religion.

That's very, no, you must never
be cremated to like, there's a

whole other perspective behind
like, no, you have to be cremated

Emily: and rights.

Rights

Jeremy: Buddhism here is shown throughout
the movie, but I think specifically

in Thailand probably burial is a
little rougher because it is so wet.

You know, you end up with a lot of,
you ended up with bodies and rivers and

stuff like that, which is no, no bueno.

Ben: That's a very good reason
for why certain cultures

developed certain customs.

Anthropology is an interesting
field of study, I guess this is my

Emily: message.

Oh, totally.

Now.

And here's the thing though, is
I don't know how normal it is for

somebody to keep the like mummified
body of their daughter in their house.

Ben: I think that's a little
not condoned in any culture.

Emily: Yeah.

Especially.

Okay.

So they go up there and they find
this mama by a body and in most movies

you'd find this, this would be a scare.

They would run the fuck out of the house.

The next scene is them talking to the mom.

And this just seems so
out of left field to me.

And I, I appreciate it.

There's a couple of
ways I'm looking at it.

One I'm like, you guys are talking to this
woman, you're continuing to interview this

woman who has the mummified, like corpse
of her daughter in her bed upstairs.

Like,

Ben: yes, this is clearly still
a rational actor we can talk to

Jeremy: hurting.

Right?

Like she's very clearly

Ben: morning reaction to hearing that her
daughter is a ghost who is haunting people

and driving them to suicide is her, is
that she is legitimately heartbroken that

her daughter's spirit isn't visiting her.

Emily: Yeah.

Which is also like really
fucked up that immediately

turned to Jane or like, oh yeah.

So this, you, your mama fi daughter,
you should cremate your daughter.

Okay.

Like, yeah, I can understand
going into somebody's house.

And then being like, oh,
you still have your, okay.

And then not just fucking cheesing it
and being like, uh, a decent person

and being like, Hey, are you okay?

Like we can need to talk about this.

You know, let's talk about

Ben: isn't capable of
being a decent person.

Emily: Yes.

But Jane is like, Hey.

You know, you should
cremate your daughter.

Like she should have funeral rights
because like that's important.

Ben: Yeah.

J Dawson rules.

Emily: And like the mom is like
sitting there and with their

water, but how fucked up is it?

It's like also your daughter's spirit
is restless and is haunting us.

So this is about us and
our problems right now.

Jeremy: He definitely doesn't say it's us.

She definitely says she's been appearing
around campus as if she's just bothering

random people around her universe.

Okay.

Emily: That's a good point.

That's a good point.

But I'm just like, I just really
want to talk about this specific

transaction and how unique it is in
a horror movie and be like this whole

situation with ghosts where like, okay.

We're sure that there's ghosts.

Jane is sure that there's ghosts because
she is essentially burdening this woman

with, you know, the absolute datum that
yes, this, her daughter is a ghost.

She is a restless spirit.

She has been haunting this campus.

And now instead of like making it.

Ben: Guess who's love to
one doesn't know any peace.

Emily: Yeah.

Like, you know, there's
so much to unpack there.

That's so nuts to me, but like, you know,
they talk about the mother is right.

Ben: Your loved one still exists
and they're being an asshole.

So telling us

Emily: stop it.

Yeah.

When she can't let go so much as
that, she can't even get the body

cremated that she's spending like tons
and tons of money on preservatives,

that she has a hallway full of.

Like, this is an art installation of
bottles that fill the entire hallway

of her house to keep this body intact.

And it's already like horrifying,
you know, like it's already

like shriveled and dead.

And so we and the mother, like,
again, the mother's reaction is

like, she could have haunted anybody.

Why couldn't she haunt me?

You know, I've been trying to con like
to communicate with her all this time

by keeping her body here, I guess.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So, but obviously she doesn't recall.

Yeah.

Ben: Oh yeah, here coast.

You can possess anybody.

I put out the Weegee boy, nothing.

Emily: I've got this doll.

Jeremy: They go to Natre's

Ben: funerals.

My neighbor, her son died.

He possesses a different person
every week and visits her the

last time you possessed somebody's

mom theatre.

Jeremy: As I said, they got a Natre's
funeral and I'm not drinking, grabs

him by the shoulder at the funeral.

And he freaks out and
runs out of the funeral.

And James like just chill out.

It's going to be done tomorrow.

Like she's going to be burned tomorrow.

Everything will be fine.

Emily: And the dad her father's there and
her father is explaining the situation

with her mom and stuff like that.

And it is not like it's not treated
like, it's a horrible thing that the

mom is not people aren't like shock.

Like the mom is doing that.

Ben: Oh, where that she was doing it.

This was common knowledge.

Jeremy: Can we find out it's not,
that came back and was depressed for

a while and couldn't wasn't herself.

And then eventually just took
a leap off of a building, like

the biggest building in town.

And then I guess, mom.

Retrieve to the body and put it back in
the bed, which none of that is is okay.

But yeah, th this jumping

Ben: off, did she get all these reserves
who is selling her, these preservatives,

who is the funeral director?

That's just like fucking
money's money, carpet

Jeremy: baggers.

So you need to preserve a dead kid.

All right.

I got that.

I got stuff for ya.

Yeah.

Also during this funeral, I think
before this funeral he gets tongue gets

a real weird look from a kid from, I
guess, a, a kid wearing a kid who's

Ben: monk robes.

This might be just, this
is culture gap, monk.

Children is a thing.

Then they are a thing, but I
definitely had to pause the movie

and be like, that's a monk child.

What the

Emily: fuck you think Angus

is also fiction

Ben: is a fiction.

Okay.

Ang is a fictional character
created by two white dudes.

So,

Emily: and there we go.

Ben: I don't want to take
that as any kind of authority.

I know.

Jeremy: It's just like
avatar the last Airbender.

Oh

Ben: no, please don't
take that out of context.

Emily: Yeah.

And yeah, there's a lot of
things we don't want to take

Ben: first sarcasm.

Emily: But no, th th there's a, there's a
child monk or a child decked out in monk.

Robes might be an acolyte.

Might be amongst family.

Don't know.

Don't know how that works, dude.

I ProgHorrorPod

Ben: knowledgeable enough to know

Emily: we are here to be educated.

Ben: We like to learn

Jeremy: our kids monks into Google.

We couldn't figure it out.

Alicia: Hey, sorry.

It's Alicia breaking in just to say
that, um, actually that's a totally

Googleable bit of information.

In fact, tens of thousands of children
in India, Butan, Nepal, Sri Lanka, and

other Asian countries are living as
child, but as months and in Thailand,

Laos and Cambodia, according to Debra
Parks, it is accepted that most humans

will disrobe or leave the monkhood
after completing their education.

All right.

That's all for me back to the.

Ben: I take monks comma child, and
that just got me the fucking TV show.

I like to Tony Shalhoub, Tony

Emily: Shalhoub scan.

Yeah.

Tony Shalhoub was a child once.

Jeremy: I don't believe

Ben: that I can go it.

It was just baby pictures
of Tony Shalhoub.

Emily: Yeah.

He came out of the womb with
like his, for his brows furrowed.

Jeremy: Um,

Okay.

So back to the plot They spend
the night at the hotel waiting for

her to be cremated the next day.

And there they fall
asleep next to each other.

I, you would think at this point
that somebody would, I don't know,

it'd be holding onto the other
person while they were asleep.

Some sort of preventative measure here.

Ben: Yeah, I end up like the scene
in Ghostbusters where the one ghost

goes to blow Dan Akroyd, but way, way,

Jeremy: yeah, he totally wakes
up to the blankets being pulled

off of him and he looks down and.

Natre is, is down at the end
of the bed pulling them down.

And I

Ben: always liked the way it go.

Fred, just hog it, all the blankets.

I

Emily: just like this.

She took the

Ben: blanket hellish.

Jeremy: Yeah.

He freaks out and like
horrible night for a cook sec.

She's not there anymore.

He looks around the room.

She's not there.

And he turns back to see,
you know, what Jane is doing.

And she's there.

She's, there's a big jump she's
right next to him where Jane should

be uh, staring at him in the face.

And he does not attempt to wake up
Jane or warn Jane what's going on.

He just, he just

Ben: fucking bolts the worst.

Ben Schwartz, voice,
John Ralphio, the worst

Jean Ralphio: I tell you, huh?

Jeremy: yeah.

And he both into the endless
stairwell and this is maybe the

most horrifying thing to me.

Cause he keeps going downstairs and
every floor is the fourth floor he keeps

going and it's not getting anywhere.

And then eventually that let's do

Ben: it.

That's the depth Floyd I did.

That's a cultural reference.

I do understand for deaf now.

Emily: Yeah.

Like how would they, they
like zoom in on the four.

And I was like, if someone
else is soothing and on 6,

6, 6, it was like, yeah.

Jeremy: And he's also no matter
how, no matter how far down he

runs, he's not getting any closer
to being out of the building.

No further.

And finally he runs into Jane.

Who's standing there in the hallway
and he's like, Jane, this is terrible.

And Jane turns around and she's not Jane.

She's not treat.

Ben: I should've guessed.

Cause how could it, how could Jane have
possibly got down the stairs before him?

Yeah,

Jeremy: so she chases him and he
runs to a window, climbs out the

window and there's a vertical
ladder on the side of this hotel.

I asked somebody about, I ask
people about those online.

I don't know if this
is common in Thailand.

Do you have a metal ladder,
the entire height of like a

hotel or something like this?

They were mentioning that it might
be something to do with the fact that

there is a lot of flooding there and
you know, people might need to climb

up to the roof of a building like this.

But, uh, the idea of

Ben: it's not a fire escape like in
New York, like I have right outside.

It's fucking ladder.

Jeremy: Yeah.

It's a vertical metal ladder
down the side of the building.

He starts climbing down this

Ben: solid snake might climb.

Yeah.

Emily: And listen, we can't
forget how she chases him down

the hallway on the ceiling.

That shit is dope.

Jeremy: Her climbing down
the ladder head first, like

Ben: that's some real evil man shit.

And I am into

Emily: it.

It was very well done.

I love this guys

Ben: again.

I'm telling you like this ringer
type, just like white dress, long

black hair, creepy ghost girl.

Like I will fucking
scared shitless every time

Emily: they did it.

Jeremy: Also, if the idea of
somebody running from ghosts, a

eternally barefoot bothers you,
man, is this movie gonna bother you?

Because he is, he has
persistently barefoot every time

he is escaping and this movie

Emily: inside.

And I don't think you're

Jeremy: in a hotel, you know, he's
running from having been asleep, but like

Emily: she's

Jeremy: climbing this wet metal ladder.

Ben: Yeah.

It takes time to wipe his ass.

He's not going to take
time to put on your shoes.

Emily: Yeah.

Hopefully he did get the rain
did wash his ass a little bit.

Cause it was raining buckets out
there and he's just like, I can't go

downstairs cause there's no down, I guess.

So I guess I'm just going to
go out the letter cause um,

Jeremy: and he doesn't have a wearing
anywhere on the ladder either.

He is he's climbing down.

He does not seem to be getting
in closer to the ground.

And he slips and falls off,
but luckily it seems John has.

Plus five against fall damage because
he wakes up in the hospital after having

fallen off the side of this building.

and then wakes up in a hospital,
I guess the next morning in

time to go see the cremation

Emily: and Jane this whole time is
like, look, it's going to be fine.

We got the funeral rights, you know,
we're going to cremate the body.

That'll take care of it, you know?

And you're sorry.

Right.

You're you're sorry.

Right.

It's

Ben: like the, the pad may mean,
and he fucking serial killer

trophies of on unspeakable crime.

Right.

Emily: God.

Jeremy: They watch somebody burn and
everything's good and grand and they go

back to the city and we learn through
excellence and shortly that I guess they

go to the beach and have a vacation.

Everything's cool.

And tun is busy.

So he sends Jane to go pick up
their photos from the beach.

And she goes through the photos has
another encounter with this guy who

owns the photo store, who looks well,
looks at a picture of her in a bathing

suit and goes late and has a real.

You know,

Ben: then he's like, he was like,
no, he says, you look fatter in this.

Not that you gained weight just right up.

You look fat.

Emily: Okay.

So it did say fatter cause like
Brett was like, oh, he said taller,

but you know, he said better.

That's what I thought.

I thought

Ben: Ghost, guest, body

Emily: shame.

And she's so that she was that there was
no ghost that she just kind of shrugs

off the potty shaving and she's just
like, ah, but then apparently turn has

not checked his negatives one more time.

Well,

Ben: I feel like the real, like
I like this movie, it could be

like, what if the real ghost was
the misogyny we met along the way?

I mean, that's,

Jeremy: I mean, it is because she
looks through all of these pictures

of the beach and everything's great.

And then she's like, oh, there's
this other set of pictures.

Let me check these out.

And there's a point in the
movie earlier where they are

lying on the couch together.

And she says that she's gonna watch
out over him while he sleeps and he's

laying in her lap and they've put
the camera on top of the television.

Uh, another whole bunch of pictures from
that night that the camera I guess took.

And in one of these pictures, she notices
that there is like a female form lying

on the ground by the photo book case.

And then she's going through.

They're in every one, but
they're slightly different.

So she decides to flip bucket and,
you know, goes through the thing

and sees that the ghost is moving
to indicate a certain shelf on the,

or a certain part of the shelf.

And she goes to look for it and knocks
down a collection of photos, which he's

has been keeping on the shelf which

Ben: are

Jeremy: of ne Natre being forcibly
held down and raped by his friends.

We learn how, because we get a flashback
to that scene of like these friends are

holding her down and we find out that
he's there and his and Taiwan is like,

Hey, take pictures of this in case she
tries to rat us out and then we can show

off the pictures of her being raped.

That's a great plan.

Hmm.

So he has, he is,

Ben: if she accuses us,
we'll just release it.

Yeah.

What the fuck is like, if she
accuses us of something, we'll just

release the proof of us doing it.

I guess

Jeremy: the part is that our, the plane is
that it would be too horribly embarrassing

Ben: for these pictures to be out
there for that's exactly what it is.

It's just banking on that
outweighing like a want for justice.

Yeah.

Emily: And like, she was already
being bullied, you know, like she

was already being abused by people.

I'm sure there was some going
on with her and turn in their

relationship because like, he, you
know, she agreed to keeping it quiet.

Ben: We've covered.

A lot of movies that have had
unfortunate to unfortunate degree.

It was like some level of
sexual harassment or sexual

assault as part of the plotline.

This is really, I think maybe
the first time we've seen a

movie that it is just full of.

Horrible.

Like on-screen rape

Jeremy: positive as
they don't sexualize it.

Like they don't

Ben: no, it's horrifying, but this
is a full on nightmarish rape scene.

So again,

Jeremy: I'm taking these
pictures of her while she is

screaming for him to help her.

And I'm like Betsy.

And I was like, oh, this is too
much like, this guy is unredeemable.

Ben: It is nightmarish.

Emily: Yeah.

This is, uh, this is it's very, I
mean, I think it's a bit gratuitous.

And it's in a movie
about ghosts and stuff.

The amount of time spent depicting
the scene, you know, again, it's not

sexualized, we don't get any sort of
you know, real nudity here, but it's

still very violent, very upsetting.

And, uh, you know, I would, I've totally
understand if it was a deal breaker.

You know, and again, this movie did,
was telegraphing that something else

was going on here, that there was
something even worse that 10 was, was

responsible for with this relationship.

And, you know, I did guess, especially
with the fact that they were dating

secretly, you know, early on, I was
guessing, okay, this is probably

going to get into assault territory.

And this is like, you know, I w it's
not quite girl with the dragon tattoo.

David Fincher, like rape scene grotesque.

But I, I, in a way it's almost
worse than that because it is not

necessarily there for shock value,
but it's still, there's too much

of it shown, I think for it to be.

Like it handled sensitively,
now, I was thankful

Jeremy: for the fact that
Jane had the same reaction.

I did do it, which is fuck
this guy like, oh yeah.

Ben: A hundred percent.

Hundred percent.

Emily: Yeah.

And he's, he explains it.

And you see that flashback where he's
looking and he's not like he's taking

the photo, but he's not looking at her.

And it's like, he almost, he looks
horrified, but he's not doing anything.

And um,

Jeremy: I'm not even saying anything.

He's not even like guys stop, uh,
just watching or not watching.

It's awful.

Ben: Yeah.

Jeremy: So Jean pieces out Jane is

Ben: like, this is unforgivable

Jeremy: goodbye.

Ben: It's like, this is fuck.

Like, this is a fate, worse than death.

That is now satisfying for us.

The eyes, because this is nightmarish.

We are now rooting for the ghost.

Yeah.

And 20%

Emily: I was already
reading for the coast.

But like now it's like,

Ben: yeah.

I mean, again, tone had it coming from
the moment he was like, we hit somebody.

Fuck it.

Drive.

Like he was cursed.

He deserved what was coming
to him from there after this.

Holy shit.

Like, again, like it is one of the
most nightmarishly horrific scenes I've

ever seen that like that rape scene, it
is very difficult to get through, but

the movie paints it as like an act of
Supreme evil that is beyond unforgivable.

That deserves only the most like horrific
of judgments, which is what he receives.

Jeremy: It comes after it stronger because
after Jane leaves, he pulls out the.

Polaroid and starts taking pictures
and trying to do the same thing.

She is like actively challenging Natre
to come out and face them, attack him,

kill him, whatever he deserves and is
taking pictures around the apartment

and can't find her and throwing
them down, finally throws the camera

down and it takes a picture of him.

And, uh, there she is in the picture,
she's sitting on his shoulders and like,

you know, we see that she is literally
on his shoulders, weighing him down.

That's why his neck has
been hurting so much.

That's what

Ben: all of the times complaining
about the neck and the x-rays.

Jeremy: Yeah, she is.

She's literally weighing on him
and starts like, you know, grabbing

and scratching at his eyes.

And he's trying to fight it off and
stumbles blindly out a window and

crashes down the length of the apartment
complex and against the ground.

And again, he has plus
five against fall damage.

So he survives this again.

He falls out of a second
building and stays alive.

And you know, w it ends with Jane
coming to see him at this psych ward

where he's locked up and we see sort of
in his reflection, he's, he's slumped

over you know, sitting on the bed and
we can see that she is just sitting on

top of him, you know, weighing him down
you know, holding him there in place.

Jane cries and then leaves.

Emily: Yeah.

And it's during this reveal of
her, on his shoulders, there's

this bit where he is taunting her.

And he's like, you know, I
thought you loved me so much.

I thought you would never leave me, you
know, till death do us part and all this

kind of stuff, which was like, terrible,
you know, it's just like, come on, dude.

Like, fuck you in the times a million, but

Jeremy: pretty much spelled
out his own curse at them.

Ben: Right?

Yeah.

Jeremy: Cause that's the
thing she's not leaving.

She's just going to

Emily: sit there and she's not going to

Ben: leave.

You never left.

You never left.

She's always just been sitting on ya.

Yeah.

Emily: And that's why I think that he
has been like, he's seen this before

and that's why I think that he decides
to like hit run because he's like, you

know, I don't know if this is real.

I dunno, but you know, we gotta go.

Um,

Jeremy: he says that the neck
pain is new, that it started

when they had the accident.

Um, no, he

Ben: says the neck pain has been lasting a
while, but it got worse with the accident.

Emily: Yeah.

Okay.

Cause I also felt like when he was at
the doctor's and he was complaining about

the neck pain, he was trying to be as
vague as possible about the accident.

So no one can

Ben: there's that too.

So it might be, it might all be.

Just hard to get a full picture, hold

Emily: up.

Yeah.

But like, no matter if he's been
seeing ghosts or not, I mean, he's

been carrying the weight of this skill.

And you know, the denial was
made it just that much worse.

The utilization of that imagery
of her being the literal weight of

guilt that he's carrying, that he has
to carry for the rest of his life.

You know, and the fact that she loved him.

So he's the one who survives,
I thought was pretty poetic.

And, you know, cause Ton, who actually
committed the rape, he fucking died.

He, he panicked and then he like
just flung himself out the window.

You know, we don't know the circumstances
under which the other two died, but

you know, they also did flash building,
which was apparently how she died.

She tried to overdose and then jumped.

You know, I don't know if
that those things are related.

Probably honestly narratively.

But this is where I feel like
all of the horror of vocabulary.

Doesn't feel rote because it is a symbolic
language that we're seeing it's not

just creepy, Sadako coming out the TV.

Cause her dad was a demon or something
like it wasn't because the deal with

Sadako is that she was just fucked up.

Like she was a demon.

Jeremy: She was Mike Myers, like evil
and then she was killed and buried in a

Emily: well, yeah, cause her mom, her
dad was like a C demon or something.

Yeah, but anyway, so

Jeremy: yeah, I, I, I think as you, as
you're saying the the symbolism of her,

like sitting on his shoulder is, is,
poetic in a way that a lot of these films

that come before and after this, around
the time are not like ring, ring, ring,

you and the American remake, the ring, I
think are both legitimately good horror

movies, but there is not like any sort of
real tie between the ghost and the people.

That's where I think

Ben: the silent hill two connection comes
from because silent hill two was all about

connecting the ghost to domain characters,
hidden secret past, and their hidden

crimes and their psychological trauma.

And I felt like that this movie very
effectively did that too, where the

ghost was very much a reflection of
that, like crime and trauma and past.

Yeah.

But I feel like that was a very
effective influence and it felt

decidedly silent Hills to ask.

Yeah.

Emily: And I also know that silent
hill was influenced by Jacob's

ladder, which has also very symbolic
visual vocabulary in terms of

Ben: you talked about the ladder when you
did a ladder scene, when she's going down

Emily: the ladder that too.

Yeah.

I

Ben: haven't seen Jacob's ladder,
so I'm just going to assume

it's a movie about a ladder.

Emily: Yeah.

It's about a ladder.

There's the ladders and the title.

Yeah.

That's sure there's a
letter in that hospital.

Jeremy: So guys, we feel like
a shattered was feminist.

I

Ben: mean, it's a movie entirely
about the most horrific crimes of men.

Emily: Yes.

I don't think it was as thoroughly
feminist as it could have gotten.

Yes.

I think it was,

Ben: I've seen as, so like I
know this is a horror movie and

it's supposed to be abstained.

Like I want to be upset and
spooked and creeped out.

And like people coming out of sinks
kind of way, not in just a gang

rape on school that goes unreported
and they get away with it without

the help of supernatural justice.

Emily: Yeah, I think this reminds me of a
lot of something that I talked to students

about, which is when they're trying to
talk about horror and they're trying to

talk about like serious stuff and tone
shock, where you have some, a story that

is a horror story, but it has a lot of
supernatural elements and kind of fun

horror, like those scenes where she's like
peeking over the car window or at the foot

of the bed, or kind of legitimately funny.

They're played seriously.

Oh yeah, they're played serious,

Ben: but I mean, that's
what makes them funny.

Emily: Yeah.

And, but that's the thing too, is that
now, you know, th the root of this

story is a very serious, terrible thing.

Now, can it be based in assault?

I think that's, you know, a
horror story about an assault.

There's a lot of ways to do that.

That are better than
how this movie did it.

You know, again, I felt like the
depiction was gratuitous, but I think

that The, uh, it was, again, a little
bit of a tone shock, a little bit

too much of a real trauma for it to
be a supernatural, like fun, spooky

ghost movie with people climbing on
like ladders upside down and shit.

You know, so I feel like that was a
little bit of a you know, a ham-handed

mistake in the, I think earnest attempt
to make this a story about the client,

the crimes have been against women.

Jeremy: Um, the 20, 21 Candyman and how
they made the very deliberate decision

to like, not show the racial violence
in that movie to do the puppet theater,

because like, you know, both Jordan
Peele, Indiana costumes were like, yeah,

people had seen enough of that shit.

Like, you know, real life people have
seen this happen, do real life people.

And, you know, current time they don't
need a full on depiction of this.

And I think that's very much true

Ben: as well.

Yeah.

I do have to say, I am really glad though.

We did the original Thai film and
not the American Japanese American

remake because Joshua Jackson's
character who's in the Tundra.

His name is Ben and describing
a character named Ben just

being this fucking horrible.

I feel like quite a bit
gotten real uncomfortable.

Oh

Emily: yeah.

Oh yeah.

Yeah,

Ben: we could avoid that one.

Jeremy: Sounds good.

I want say it, this movie has
been remade three times already.

There's the movie civvy from 2007, which
is an Indian remake shutter from 2008,

which is the American one and click
from 2010, which is a Hindi remake.

So it's it's out there.

It's a

popular

Ben: one.

Yeah.

And I mean,

Emily: yeah, it's, it is tempting
to talk about this kind of poetic

justice, but it does take us an extreme
amount of care on the writer's part.

And I mean, on the entire storytelling
crew there you know, and I, I, I think

it's important not to ignore or you know,
it's, it's important to talk about, but

there are ways to talk about it in a movie
about supernatural, you know, ooky spooky,

haunting without it being so in your face.

Yes.

But, uh,

Jeremy: it's really interesting to
have Jane as sort of a second main

character for this, because we do get
to see a lot of it through her eyes.

And we are, she is a surrogate
for the audience in a lot of ways,

because she is sort of figuring
out why they're actually cursed.

She is, starts off very worried that you
know, her running over this girl has been

the cause of all of this, which will,
which we find out that never happened.

She never ran over a girl.

That's just the first of
her hunting situations.

Ben: Well, Jane gives us
a protagonist that we can

actually root for in like yeah.

And

Jeremy: does the best thing for almost
any, you know, protagonist in a movie

like this, which is she walks away.

Like, she's just like what an
asshole this guy really is.

And she's like, no, that's unforgivable

Ben: the fact that honestly, the
ghost, um, notcher tells her like

leads her to, it was like, Hey, Hey
girl, fucking check this shit out.

He is not a good guy.

Like I'm telling you like girl, the girl.

Get out.

Yeah.

Like she's, uh, she's not hunting Jane.

Emily: No she's communicating to Jane.

Ben: at the very least, I appreciate that
the movie wasn't like, oh, the crazy ghost

of the ax is after the current girlfriend.

I'm glad it was like hitting
them against each other.

Emily: Yeah.

Which does lead me to what I want
to talk about, which is the, the

depiction of mental illness and
disability and stuff like that.

Where, we see the Natras has some
conditions that she has to deal

with with the, uh, threat of suicide
when 10 tries to break up with her.

And you know, I'm sure that there's more
to that, but they don't they never really

show that as being like the crazy ex.

She does look very.

Daunting at times, like when she's got
the she's like wiping her hand on the

glass shard that, you know, she's, she
slit her wrists and stuff like that.

Again, you know, also very
triggering suicide imagery.

But she is depicted as completely.

Oh God, what's the word I'm looking for?

I just left my brain.

Um,

She's, you know, she's relatable,
like, Natras is relatable and

you know, innocent completely

Jeremy: the back, uh, which is
again told through you know,

uh, the point of view of tun.

Their relationship feels very much like an
anime of like, she is the distant girl who

doesn't know how to get along with people.

And he just takes a liking to her,
despite his friends being assholes, like

their, you know, their whole thing is.

Oh, she's the, she's the pretty
girl who just can't relate to

people up until the part where he
is keeping their relationship a

secret and is a complete asshole.

And then she starts threatening
him with committing suicide.

Emily: Yeah.

And that's like, it's definitely
implied that the group of guys consider

her like crazy and clingy when they
find out about this and I'm sure

that that was completely encouraged.

If not actively, then
passively encouraged by a ton.

Who's like not defending her and
pretending that she's, it doesn't exist

when they're all together, you know?

God,

Ben: I mean, it's, it's impossible
not to talk about the scene.

On this section of the podcast.

Emily: Yeah.

And, And also with, when we talk
about trauma and things like that,

like a lot of that is pretty upfront.

Right.

the, uh, the haunting as a result of
guilt, I think that that's a really

powerful message when we talk about, the
ghost and the carry around of the past.

But I also think it's very telling
that Jane starts to see this

haunting and as gas lit, you know,
like he can't hide his guilt.

So Jane actually is being contacted by
the ghost as if to represent him and his

guilt, kind of like what he's carrying
around and those cracks showing that she's

starting to recognize those red flags.

And there's all these times when.

They're talking about it and
she's like, well, what happened?

You know?

And he talks about it
and he says, he's sorry.

And she's like, and that's it.

And he's like, yeah, I
don't know anything else.

You'll never leave me.

Right.

You'll never leave me.

Right.

Right.

Like he completely changed as a subject.

Ben: that you'll never leave
me no matter what like that.

And that was a red flag.

Oh my God.

You

Jeremy: know, it's interesting to me now
to think about the fact that like this

ghost appears to her for the first time
after she sees him for the first time

with his group of friends, like when he's
being that go alone to get along asshole,

like covering for his friend, who's
already cheating on his brand new wife.

You know, she's, she sees that
side of him for the first time.

And that's when you know, this ghost
first shows up to her at least.

Yeah, I think that's really,
it's really interesting.

I think it says a lot about the how
relationships are played in this story.

Yeah, that's the first time she's seen
the version of him that allowed, you

know, not DRI to be raped by his friends
because she was too needy for him.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's, it's super fucked up.

Again, I, I think we've
talked about this on, on other

foreign films we've discussed.

I don't think there's a lot to be
said about racial or social justice

that we can say in this, that we
don't really have the context we need.

I think, to make an informed discussion,
there, there is certainly something

to be said about class as far as
like, they are all living in Shanghai

and these super nice apartments.

And, you know, when come see
Bangkok, they're living in Bangkok

in these super nice apartments.

And when we do see Natres house and
Natre's mom, it is sort of not a,

not a terrible house, but it's way
deep out in the country and this, you

know, little village in the middle of
nowhere you know, sort of implying,

I think, uh, a divide in class.

Emily: Yeah, I do want to mention,
and this has nothing to do with

progressive politics, but that it was
interesting that the mom had all of

those preserved butterflies on the wall.

And then we have this idea of
all these, like you had all the

imagery of the preserved animals
and then Natre herself is preserved.

And I know she was a science
major and she was into biology.

So maybe that's where they got the.

And this specialty preservatives,
but anyway, I just, but I wanted

to mention that cause I thought
that was visually interesting.

Anyway,

Jeremy: I think, I mean, maybe the
only place I can think of that we

would have anything to say about LGBTQ
plus people in themes in this movie

is, are a sex worker in the bathroom.

I don't know if that scene is meant
to be played for laughs or what?

I think she definitely comes off
as somebody who is very chill.

If nothing else, like he busts in there
and she's like, you know, hold on.

At least let me finish what I'm
doing here before he then runs off.

I don't know what else we're
we're meant to glean from that.

Yeah,

Ben: that's a, yeah,
I got nothing on that.

I'm just going to say she
was, uh, she was awesome.

Yeah, no curses there that
she is living a blessed life.

We wish her nothing but the best.

Emily: Yeah.

She should like haunt him.

Ben: Her movie, she's getting
ready to go star in the Thai land.

Remake of pretty woman.

Yeah.

Emily: There you go.

Ben: That's my head.

Canada's that?

Well, he's having this awful
time in the horror movie.

She's in the sex worker with
a heart of gold Richard year.

Romantic colony.

The Tyree makes still stars.

Richard Gere.

Jeremy: Yeah, of course.

Well guys, do we feel like, uh, do
we recommend this one for be able

to waiting is where it's seen,

Emily: if mind again, mind the

Jeremy: asterisk?

Ben: This movie is very creepy.

It's very unsettling.

It's a very affectively told
a horror story, but wow.

That scene, that one scene

Emily: in terms of craft and set up.

Yeah.

I can see why this movie
was remade so many times.

The building.

The story structure around that and all
the decisions, the visual decisions, the

Ben: reveal of why like his neck
has been hurting the whole time.

I think that's such a
well-executed twist or

Emily: explanation poetic.

Ben: Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean it's yes.

With an asterick is I think
the best way of putting it.

Yeah.

Jeremy: I think giant,
giant asterisk on there.

It is definitely worth seeing, but
if it sounds like something that

will bother you, it almost certainly.

And, you know, to take care of yourself,

Ben: if you prefer to just know
from this podcast, what happens plot

wise, and then just fast forward
through that whole scene, that might

be the ideal viewing experience.

Emily: If you're watching it for free
on voodoo, there will certainly be

several commercial breaks beforehand.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Like we said, it's not streaming
anywhere that we could find

without commercials, but voodoo
has it for you with commercials.

Again, it is in for ADP definition.

If that bothers you.

I, I was, I was trying not to
be snooty about it, but I was

like, even the subtitles are
a little blurry at this point.

Emily: I mean, it is a bummer
because it is like, first of

all, this is a movie that, uh, it
really was made it's well shot.

And it also relies on a lot
of like subtle imagery, which

is a big bummer for 40 P like

Ben: yeah.

Jeremy: Yeah.

Um, it deserves a deserves at least at
10 80, upgrade about that 4k upgrade.

Ben: So, uh, what do we recommend if
he'll want to see something similar.

. Or just, what do you recommend in general?

What you've been watching,
if there's some goodies,

Emily: I mean, you can watch our
flag means death because I've

Ben: been watching it.

You should watch our flag meets death.

Emily: If you want something that's like
a nice, you know, just to, to clean the,

the old funk after those horror movies.

But if you want a horror movie that
has similar aesthetics, less of a plot,

and just a lot of like generally creepy
stuff that doesn't have anything to

do with like excessively real horror.

There is a, uh, of live-action
adaptation of Uzzah Maki.

That is just all vibes.

And in terms of the spookiness and the
spooky imagery in this movie, that one

is very similar, but it just, it doesn't
hit as hard of course, like, you know,

again, and also it's not super well paced.

If you want something this well
paste read the comic book, the

comic by Jenji EO five stars.

Jeremy: Uh, ben, what've you got?

Ben: I mentioned this earlier, but
I'm going to go with archive 81.

It's a real spooky Netflix horror show.

It is very much all about kind of like
a found footage, photography video,

and, you know, similarly what kind
of spirits and other worldly things

we capture uh, through uh, film.

And now I really like it.

The first season is really good.

Fair warning.

Netflix did a Netflix and did
cancel it after one season.

So unfortunately ends have
a big old cliffhanger.

That's never going to get resolved.

Emily: That's fucked up.

Jeremy: Hate that.

Do you not like it?

All right.

I feel like I can recommend
stuff all day long at this point.

Uh, I will say, we've mentioned
Ringu or the ring a lot.

If you like the style of scariness and
everything that's in this movie, that is,

I think that the progenitor of this in
a lot of ways, it is both to its benefit

and detriment this, without all the
sexual violence but sort of unrelated.

When I have been watching and enjoying
this last week I did watch something

based on our friend Benito Serena's
recommendation, which is the night

house which is available on HBO max.

Right now, it is a movie about a
woman whose husband committed suicide.

And then she suddenly finds herself
haunted by what seems to be his ghost.

But it's much deeper and weirder than
that and involves a, house which is a

perfect replica of hers that is built
across the lake that only exists at night.

And some real creepy shit, uh,
in this movie really well done.

It's not a big jump scare
movie, but it does have a lot

of like great creepy stuff.

Uh it's in a lot of ways, pretty far
from what we experienced in shutter here.

Uh, the main character is Rebecca Hall.

our good buddy Vondie Curtis hall is
in this not wearing a terrible wig.

I definitely recommend checking it
out cause it was a, I hesitate to say

a lot of fun, but it was very good.

Emily: Excellent.

Jeremy: And other than that, I've just
been playing, I just finished playing.

Horizon forbidden west.

If you have a PS five, go play that game.

It's great.

Emily: that's good.

Jeremy: Yeah, there's uh, lots of gay
men characters, supporting characters.

There's a trans characters.

There's all sorts of
relationships and stuff in there.

It's well executed.

it's really fun.

We played the first one and liked it.

I think it's everything.

That's good about the first
one, amped up to a whole nother

level and it's beautiful.

All right.

Uh, well, that's it for us.

If you're looking for
us online, you can find

emily@megamouthontwitteroramega_mothoninstagramandmegamouthdotnetmendezontwitteratbenthekhanandontheirwebsiteatbenkahncomics.com,
where you can pick up all their books,

including the brand new immortals,
Phoenix, rising graphic novel from

great beginnings and the glad award
nominated Renegade rule graphic novel.

And finally, for me, you can find me
on Twitter and Instagram at J Rome five

eight and my website@jeremywhitley.com.

And you can check out everything
I write there on my website.

And of course the podcast is on
Patrion at progressively horrified

on And our website, it progressively
horrified that transistor.fm and on

Twitter at ProgHorrorPod, uh, where
we would love to hear from you.

Uh, so come chat with us about
this movie, what you thought about

what you liked, what you didn't
speaking of loving to hear from you.

We would love to get reviews from you.

We would love a five star review wherever
you're listening to this that will

help new listeners to find us as well.

Thank you all for joining us here and
thank you as always to Ben and Emily.

It was a ball the fund talk

Ben: about yeah, always have last indeed.

See, and ya'll.

Jeremy: Yeah.

And until next time
everybody stay horrified.

Alicia: Progressively horrified
as created by Jeremy Whitley

and produced by Alicia Whitley.

This episode featured the horror squad,
Jeremy Ben, and Emily, all opinions

expressed by the commentators are solely
their own and do not represent the intent

or opinion of the filmmakers nor do they
represent the employers, institutions,

or publishers of the commentators.

Our theme music is epic darkness
by Mario Cole of six and was

provided royalty-free from pixie.

If you liked this episode,
you can support us on Patrion.

You can also get in touch with us
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email@progressivelyhorrifiedatgmail.com.

Thanks for listening.

Bye.