Jeremy: Is this anybody's
first time watching this one?

Michael: Yeah, it had been in my shutter,
queue for probably three years at

least, and I just had not watched it.

So that, that's part of why I was like,
yeah, I'll, I want to be on this episode.

I'll give me an excuse to finally watch
that movie and clear out my queue.

Jeremy: Yeah, I'm always looking
for excuses to clear up my queue.

Unfortunately, all the movies in my queue
are like three hours long right now.

Thanks, Oppenheimer.

I just like, Oppenheimer's been in my
queue since it showed up, and I just

can't, I can't bring myself to, somebody
was asking me if I'd seen it the other

day, I was like, I just, I, I can't.

I've watched so many great
man biopics over the years, I

just, I just have no interest.

I'm sure it's great.

Like I,

Jay: don't know, I was
a little, bored by it.

I think it's just biopics in general,
I, you know, it's, It's so difficult

to watch, I feel like it's rare that
people do a really, truly great one.

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: the only biopics that
really work for me are the ones

where they just like choose.

a moment, an event or something.

They're like, this is the thing
we're going to talk about this,

two weeks, five minutes, whatever.

Kevin: live, we live in
a post walk hard world.

It's hard to take any life
biopics seriously at this point.

Emily: Oh my god, yeah.

Jeremy: I love Walk Hard.

good evening and welcome to
Progressively Horrified, the podcast

where we hold horror to progressive
standards that never agreed to.

Tonight, we're talking about a
great if somewhat under the radar

horror film coming out of Japan.

It's called, uh, One Cut of the Dead.

I am your host, Jeremy Whitley.

And with me tonight, I have a
panel of xenophiles and xenobites.

First, I said, I definitely
said xenophiles, which is weird.

I'm going to go back.

We'll go back on that one.

I am your host, Jeremy Whitley.

And with me tonight, I have a
panel of xenophiles and xenobites.

First, they're here to challenge us.

Nope.

Nope.

Ben isn't here.

Man, I'm just launching into it.

Ben isn't here tonight, but we do,
as always, have the cinnamon roll of

Cenobites, my co host, Emily Martin.

Emily, how are you?

Emily: I'm doing great.

this, Movie's been on my list for
a very long time and I've actually

been holding on to it because I
knew that we would eventually Watch

it and now we did and I'm happy.

Jeremy: Yeah, I definitely watched
this one initially as a result of

somebody like one of our other guests
on here recommending it, so, strong

ties with the podcast, this one.

And we have three special guests tonight.

First writer and editor and friend
of the podcast, Kev Kettner.

Kevin, great to see you.

Kevin: Yeah, thanks for having me Thanks
for giving me an excuse to rewatch this

movie because it is a very different
experience a second time through.

Jeremy: yeah, it's a wild one the first
time, and the second time you just really

get to soak it all in, I feel like.

Also we have with us comic writer and also
friend of the podcast, Michael Tanner.

Michael, good to see you again.

Michael: Good to see you all.

I think last time we did this we weren't
on video so I didn't get to see all

your wonderful faces And now I'm seeing
your wonderful faces and this is audio

podcast So the audience has no idea
about this, but I like I like seeing

you all and thank you for having me on

Jeremy: Absolutely.

We do have wonderful faces, I have to

Emily: we all have very wonderful faces.

Jeremy: Wonderful faces.

And also a friend of the
podcast and writer Jay Joseph.

Jay, great to see you again.

Jay: I'm actually very
excited to talk about this.

I'm usually excited to talk about
the films on here, but I think this

one was very, this particular one was
cathartic for me for a couple of reasons.

This is my second time watching it, but,
uh, the first time it was very, very

cathartic and I'll talk a little bit
about why as we get into the podcast.

Emily: Yeah, I'd love to hear

Jeremy: Yeah, it's, it's
a really wild movie.

It was made for 20, 000 bucks.

It made 20 million bucks.

And, you know, continues to, like,
it's, it's on Shudder where I'm

sure it's getting a lot of exposure
for, being a relatively small movie.

It is a lot of fun.

We'll, we'll talk about some of,
sort of, the meta ness of it.

It is a movie about movies in a
way that most movies about movies

are not movies about movies.

It makes them look like movies
that aren't about movies.

It is directed by Shinichiro Ueda.

Uh, it is co written by
him and Ryoichi Wada.

Emily, do you want to go
through the, starring list here?

much better at pronouncing,
Japanese names than I am.

Emily: Let's see, so we've got directors,
uh, Shinichiro Ueda, the writers

Shinichiro Ueda and Ryoichi Wada,
and starring Takeyuki Hamatsu, Yuzuki

Akiyama, Harumi Shuhama, Kazuaki Nagaya,
Hosoi, and Hiroshi Ichihara and Mao.

Jeremy: The mononymous mouth.

so the movie.

Every description of has about the
same like 10 word description of it.

initially you are being
shown a movie about,

Jay: But before you get into it,
should we give them one of those like.

YouTube style disclaimers that
maybe don't watch the podcast

until after you've seen the movie.

Jeremy: Yeah.

I

Emily: Yeah, definitely
watch the movie first.

Jay: Yeah, but

Michael: ahead

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: if you, if you intend to

Jay: spoilers.

I feel like part of the treat of
the film is how it kind of like

surprises you as it progresses.

So if you come in here without prior
knowledge and you're like the least

bit curious about it, I would say,
put this on pause, suddenly come

back, but watch the first, you know,
and then come back and listen to us.

Jeremy: yeah, it

Emily: Kahn, shutter.

Jeremy: watchable film.

You know, it's, it's reasonably short too.

It's, a nice 96 minutes which is, is
the perfect length for a horror film.

I feel like horror films, I feel
like really need to be able to

justify going over a hundred minutes.

It

Emily: Sorry, I'm still dealing with that.

Ha ha ha

Jeremy: felt like a year.

Emily: ha ha ha

Jeremy: yes, so there's,
there's sort of a twist to it.

In fact, there's sort
of several twists to it.

And that we are initially shown this,
horror movie about a, handsome zombie

boy you know, attacking this, this zombie
girl who is slowly cornering and she

is getting ready to ax him until like
we are pulled out of that as she is

being bitten by a director yelling cut.

And it pulls out and we see that this is
actually, this, we're watching this film

being filmed we get to meet sort of this
director who's an absolute psychopath, who

starts out by, yelling at this, this girl
on her face about how she has no idea what

she's doing and she's a terrible actress,
so on and so forth you know, they end

up sort of going on break and the, the
director disappears as, her co star and

the makeup woman sort of, Comfort Her.

There's various other, you know, sound
guys and everything that are part

of the cast who are walking around
and doing various film tasks, but

we're mostly focused on these sort
of three, the two movie stars and

the makeup lady as this is happening.

And of course, we find out naturally
that they are filming this zombie movie.

in a place where there, have been rumored
to have been some sort of horrible

zombie like things that happened here
involving the government and summoning

and possible it's very vague about
what exactly it is that went on in

the way that so many zombie films are.

It quickly spirals into
this B horror movie.

There's a lot of like weird gaps.

There's a lot of, you know, long pauses,
sounds that don't really make any sense.

Things that don't quite pay off.

But like, it, it turns into this sort
of fun horror movie in which, you know,

eventually, you This, you know, lead girl
has to sort of, eventually end up hacking

up the, the handsome boy co star who is
who's playing the zombie in the movie.

Eventually, you know, they
are set against each other and

the director keeps popping in.

And my, my favorite part of this movie
is the director keeps popping in and

basically just throwing zombies at
them and yelling action, he films his,

his stars being attacked by zombies
she eventually chops him to death.

she finds this star drawn in blood on
the roof of the place that has, been used

to summon these zombies by the director.

So.

And that is sort of the close of the
movie, or in our case, the close of

the first half of the movie because the
second half of the movie is actually

about how that first movie is a movie that
is being made by all the people that we

met in the first half of the movie who
have actually different roles who are

actors and directors and various things
making this film And the director, who

is the same guy who played the director
in the movie, is basically conscripted

by this, this group to do a mediocre
job because he's known for just going

along and doing a, an okay job at, at
making movies because they really want

to do a live film of like a zombie
movie with the launch of their zombie

TV channel with him sort of like, with
them doing it both live and in one take.

Hence the, the name One Cut of the Dead.

It's all done in, in one shot.

Which is both masterful in the way that
it's done in the movie, but then also as

the second half unfolds, we find out the
story of them making this, which, all of

the various actors who are playing all
of the parts of the people who are making

the movie all have their own things.

Um, One of the, the actors is an alcoholic
and is, you know, has shaky hands and

is drinking enough to he's sort of like
passing out at various points in this one

of the guys has a very nervous stomach and
ends up drinking somebody else's water.

And then having horrible stomach
related emergencies throughout

the filming of this thing.

And this director is just sort of
running around trying to make this whole

thing work while also sort of dealing
with this in this internal struggle

he's having of him really wanting to
connect with his daughter who also

wants to be a director and make films.

And it's sort of disappointed in him
for his media, which is, his driving

thing, especially in the first and the
second half of this part of the story.

We also have his, his wife who is
playing the makeup lady in this, who is

a former actress who stopped acting, we
find out, because she got too caught up

in her characters and, broke, another
person's arm while making a movie.

So decided to stop acting.

And of course, inevitably she has to
step in to play the, uh, the makeup

lady and then gets, gets too caught
up in the action and ends up in, in

one of the more amazing parts of this
having to be choked out until she is

unconscious so that they can finish
filming the movie because she is, Over

the top with her character and then ends
up waking up in the middle of the climax

Popping into it and and something one
of the many moments that in the first

half of the movie You see happen and
you're like what the fuck is that about?

And you forget about and then the second
half of the movie you're like, oh, right.

I forgot And it's it's really sort of
this just masterful movie on top of a

movie on top of a movie Because I know
I've talked to several people who like

got to the end of the first movie and
they were like, oh, is, is that it?

Is that the end of the movie?

And at least one person I've talked to
shut it off at that point and had to

be convinced to go back and watch it.

Emily: I fully did pause it.

And I was like, Yeah, and then
I, and then it was like suddenly

the, the, Curtain parts again, and
I'm like, it's the Björk video.

Bachelorette, it's a thing.

Michelle Goddard.

But um, the meta ness, like, a lot of
times when I would see something like

this, I would be a little bit jaded
by it, but this was fully charming.

Like, everything about the, this,
this story about the movie being made

was engaging and charming and, like,
the characters had these, these great

little portraits of each of them and
but I, yeah, the, the moment I paused

at the credits of the One Cut of the
Dead zombie movie and I saw that like

three quarters of the bar had yet to
be filled on the bottom of the screen.

And I was like that.

Okay, I'm buckled in.

Let's go.

Kevin: yeah, that was, that was, yeah,
that I, I, just everybody, when this was

coming out, people were talking about it,
like, you really need to check it out.

And I was like, well, all right, I will.

And like five minutes in,
I was like, I hate this.

I can't believe.

I can't believe I fell for people.

Like, why were, is it just
because it's one take?

Is that why everybody's
talking about this?

And then, like, like, like you said,
like, charming's the exact word I

use when I talk to people about it.

All of it's charm is,
like, my attitude shifting.

Like, I, I'm like, why is this so bad?

Like, I just, you know, I'm just trying
to wrap my head around the first act,

and the second act, I'm like, oh, okay.

And then watching them make the zombie
movie in the zombie, you know, like at

the end, the third act, like there's
a smile that comes to my face that

doesn't go away for the last 30 minutes.

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: yeah, maybe the wildest part, I
don't know if everybody watched into the

credits of the movie itself, is they show
you like, there's somebody filming them,

filming the movie, filming the movie.

Because like, they really are doing this.

all at the same time on top of each other.

You've got like, the actors and
then the camera crew and then

the camera crew on top of that.

And it's, it's really, it's really wild.

And I think charming is, is a great word
for it because I think the like, the

20, 000 budget really works in their
favor in a lot of ways of like winning

you over because it feels You know,
it, it really feels pasted together.

Like they're just just barely making
it and they're, you know, because

they are making a cheap horror movie,
they can then skimp on the, budget

of the actual horror movie under the,
the comedy drama about making movies

Michael: Yeah.

I had a moment like, I think almost
everybody, like during the credits of

that first section, I had to think, I was
like, well, when did I start this movie?

I knew it was like 90 minutes and I was
like, I was like, oh, you know what?

There's there's, it's only been Like
at that point, I was like, well, I

know it's been less than an hour.

So I was like, Oh, so maybe like after
the credits, they do like a behind the

scene because I watched on shutter.

So I kind of thought they're dead, maybe
tacked on bonus features to the runtime.

And I was thinking
like, Oh, that was cute.

Like, it was like going through it.

There's the moments as it kind
of like, it starts to snowball.

Things start to go off the rails.

Like there's weird, like,
awkward pauses that.

My first watch, I was just
like, Oh yeah, I get it.

Like, it's hard to do a one shot.

And they really did it as one shot.

And then it just escalated.

I was like, wait, is this
movie fucking with me?

This movie's fucking with me.

I think this movie's fucking with me.

And yeah, it's charming and I think
it's the most delightful movie

I've seen in a very long time.

Emily: is every genre, I think.

I mean, if you forgive the parody,
it is pretty, like, pan genre.

Michael: Comedy, like family heartstrings,
you know, the father daughter mom dynamic.

Yeah.

Goddamn delightful.

Jay: I've grown pretty sensitive
to film timing over the years.

I don't know if it's because I
grew up around it or because I had

to just kind of like teach myself
patience with it and all that.

But I think it's one of the most One
of the things that fits into the meta

ness of it is one of the most three act
structure aware films I've ever seen.

It's essentially, three short
films that connect into, like,

an overarching narrative, right?

But about this thing about, about the
film being charming and why The Menace

works, I think that is rooted in the
fact that watching movies about making

movies tend to be like really boring.

You know, there's, there's kind
of a standard for I think Singing

in the Rain was the first one that
arguably really did it way back when.

And then, The issue when you have
these self referential films, and

even when you do it like in television
or whatever else creators get really

hung up in just kind of, showing kind
of like how the sausage is made and

making a lot of in jokes that only other
filmmakers would get and all that, right?

And then.

What this film does that's special is
that it kind of links it back to the

poor family drama that takes place
with the Higurashi family, right?

With Takayuki and Harumi
and his daughter Mao, right?

Even the lead character of the film.

The actual one cut that we watched
of the zombie movie is named now and

kind of like a reference to that.

this dude's daughter now.

And so, we see a director who's in
the first act, he's like, Essentially

the antagonist of the film, right?

That's something else it does.

It plays with the idea of the
unreliable narrator and switching

your protagonist from one to the
other and showing us how to follow.

So, initially we're following Nao,
or rather the actress that plays Nao,

and then we're following Takayuki.

And then in the final act, we're kind
of following a combination of Takoyuki

and his daughter, Mao and it really ends
up being a film about, you know, the

Sigurashi family kind of banding together
and keeping themselves relevant in the

film industry and kind of like pushing
their limits, but it ties it back in

a sense that we can understand, right?

It's not that Mao, she wants to
be, a really kind of dedicated

producer and director like her
dad, and she does want that.

But she has a crush on a boy, right?

She has a crush on the lead actor that
they get, and he wants some kind of you

know, he wants to do something nice for
his daughter, because she's having a

hard time at work and all that, right?

The daughter Mao, she's very
encouraging of her mother, right?

Harumi wants her to get back into kind
of filmmaking, but because now Mao is

about to go off to pursue her own career
or whatever it is, and Harumi, Uh,

it's free to kind of like explore her
own hobbies and get her own life back.

So I think the film ties it together in
a way that really resonates with a lot

of people, where a lot of movies about
making movies aren't concerned with that,

aren't concerned with that humanity.

And I think that's part of what
makes One Cut kind of like so

rich and enjoyable to watch.

Emily: Yeah.

And it's interesting or I should
say, it is, Impressive to me that

they managed to get so much character
work done in the, the small amount

of time in, like, the act 2, right?

Where, you know, act 1 is the movie, act
2 is the, the, them trying to make the

movie, and act 3 is them making the movie.

And so, in act 2, and like, this is, 20
minutes of, film that they're basically

building these characters and yeah, this
is within a 90 minute horror movie, or

I should say 90 minute movie altogether.

Jeremy: Yeah, I, I, I really like what
Jay was saying about sort of the shifting

roles of the different characters and,
and that even in, in, even in between,

Act two and three, I feel like the
mom goes from being the hero of the

story to like a villain where she is
like, she becomes a force of nature.

She's out of control.

She's going to destroy the film to the
point that they have to like, it takes

the whole crew to basically take her
down so that they could finish the movie

Kevin: Like the moment where Like,
when she's in character as the makeup

woman, where she's no longer the makeup
woman, she's like the survivor in

this horror movie, and the look on her
face is so perfect, it made me laugh

so hard watching through this time.

Which,

Emily: really great set up.

Even in there was really, I thought there
was really great set up, even within

the, the actual horror movie where they
were doing the, like, trying to do the

scene and then they do the scene again,
but he's actually a zombie now and then.

You, you can hear her little self
defense she's, she's like, so you

hear it, like, you know, the, the
camera is on the, the main actress.

And then you hear a struggle in the
background, and it is very, like, kind of

Looney Tunes esque where you hear, like,
all sorts of shit happening, but you just,

those context cues is maybe everything you
need to know that she's, like, defending

herself with her self defense clasp.

techniques and her, her acts,
you know, that she's using.

She was great.

Like her character from start to
finish, like every time, every

role she was in, she was fantastic.

Jeremy: they do the trick of her, like
reference, like calling back to her

own line that she hasn't said yet.

And the story is, is very, I love it.

Whereas she's like, she says early
on that she's dead calm, and then

like, in the movie she says that,
and then, you know, her husband is

like, I need you to calm down, and
she's like, oh, I'm calm, dead calm.

Like, as she is flipping out in
the same way that the character is

flipping out, is like, it's so good.

Jay: And it's, it's really great, I think
almost reversal of the roles in the family

because when we first meet Takayuki, he's
really the, the strong, praised antagonist

of the film, tormenting the crew, and
who we learn later on is his, you know,

wife, by tossing the zombies at him,
which there's a very strong good narrative

reason for that we find out later on.

You know, and then it basically, basically
shift over the course of the movie.

And then it's, we kind of find, as we
find the real circumstances, they're

now kind of having to deal, you know,
as people said with Rumi and all that.

And I think it's really great
how they play with the different

perspectives the character roles, right?

I think in general it's really
difficult for film to know not only

how to deal with like an ensemble
cast, but also how to appropriately

switch perspective between different
characters and have it feel natural.

And one kind of feels very, very natural.

Emily: Yes.

Jeremy: Yeah, I think.

One of the things that works, I think,
so well about this movie is that there

aren't, with the exception of the, the two
people who are playing actors, everybody

just feels kind of like real people.

You know, they, they feel like working
actors, and there, there aren't a

lot of like superstars and they're
sort of, you dressed up as these you

know, he is an idol and she is this,
actress who like, she's in a zombie

movie, but she's like, oh, you know,
my agency won't let me get vomited on.

That's, there's no way that
that's going to be okay with them.

I'd be fine with it, but my agency, you
know, that's, that's not going to fly.

Kevin: going back to something you
said, is like, very funny, because we

already know that somebody vomits on
her by the time she says that line.

Jay: And then, you know, I think this goes
back into feeds back a little bit into

what I was saying about the you know, how
movies about movies tend to have a lot of

in jokes, you know, for other filmmakers,
and I think they exist here too, but they

exist in such a way that they still have,
like, narrative relevance to the audience.

For example their The guy who plays the
sound guy in the film and his demands

for, he needs to have he can't drink
hard water, he needs soft water, right?

Or else he'll get terrible
diarrhea or whatever.

And I think, I think getting these weird
demands from actors and all that, you

know, you hear those stories, you get
those characters sometimes in film,

but then it comes back later on and
it becomes like a serious hindrance

to creating the actual One Cut of the
Dead and they have to get around it.

Jeremy: I feel so bad for that guy in
that scene where he is having to, he's

having to just shit in the bushes.

Kevin: I feel worse for the makeup
person who had to put the zombie

makeup on him while it was happening.

Yes,

Jeremy: Jay was saying there, I think
it does this incredible thing of like

introducing you to this stereotype of
a director who like is uncompromising.

Well, you know, do whatever
he has to, to get the shot.

And then what you meet is a much
more, I think, realistic depiction

of a director as this, this guy
who's just like struggling, right?

He's just trying to get something
out there that he can be a little

bit proud of and get it done on time.

Like,

Michael: Yeah.

He he's a work.

He's a like a workman director.

Like he's, he's not superstar.

He's directing commercials and TV shows.

He's it's, it's a job.

He's not an auteur.

Jeremy: yeah, and the third act of it
is, is the story of him getting from that

point to like, putting in all that work,
to them saying they're gonna pull the

plug on the thing halfway through, and
him like, actually channeling that initial

character that he's playing, to be like,
no, this is like, it has to happen like

this, we're gonna do it this way, I'm
the director here, and then immediately

just like feeling bad about it.

Emily: He's like,

Michael: he's, he's doing a great
job of pulling from his daughter.

Like he's really like taking
inspiration from his daughter in there.

Cause we, and they did a great job
establishing, like she gets fired off

a job for berating the actress, just
like we see him do at the beginning and

having that kind of like strong will.

It's a, it's another example
of really great payoffs.

Emily: I do want to mention that the
actress that she's berating is a child.

Jeremy: Yes.

Emily: So, you know,
it's important context.

Kevin: I think that like really works
great especially with that character

and like the kind of everybody's sort of
evolving in such a short period of time

is like yeah she's that young like, I went
to school for film, so I know plenty of

these people who are like, so like set
like, Oh, no, you can't use eye drops.

It's got to be real.

You got, you know, that whole thing.

And she's, she's dismissive about her
father's philosophy of quick and cheap.

And at least it'll be
average type of thing.

But I love that, like, once they get
into, like, them filming the movie,

and she's watching it fall apart,
and she's just like, right, we just

gotta get it done, and, like, I feel
like that's such a great moment for

her to, like, understand her father
and how the real world kind of works,

especially with art and stuff, you know?

Emily: There are three hour movies that
do not have character arcs this strong.

Jay: No, absolutely.

Absolutely.

And especially when you don't have that
much access to the characters in the first

place, because we're essentially following
new groups throughout the entire thing.

But I said this film was
cathartic for one reason.

I'm not quite at discussing why yet,
but I did want to jump on there since

Jeremy brought up this character of
you know, Takayuki and how he kind

of, you Behaves as like a demanding
auteur for the sake of the, you know,

film's kind of plot and all that.

And then we find out, as people
have said, he's a working director

and then his daughter has certain
expectations of the world and all that.

And I feel that really runs
an interesting spectrum.

of people that you do encounter
in the industry, especially as it

pertains to people in kind of creative
positions, like, as, as directors

and and producers primarily, right?

Screenwriters, I think, we're, we're
more of a kind of self deprecating lot

in general, but, you know, I, I think
With directors and producers, a lot

of them are like, Takayuki, where, you
know, they really are just trying to,

you work paycheck to paycheck, they
are searching maybe for their, big

break to check the chance or all that.

I think in Takayuki's case, it's more
that he's a little scared and nervous

and intimidated by this project.

And I, I think that's also a very
real feeling that, am I ready?

Can I actually take
something like this on?

And the answer is exactly what the
film gives where, first off they

have like zero prep time to make
the film within the film, one cut.

But once you get on set, right,
no matter how many factors you

control for, it's always chaos.

There's always something
that's going to go wrong.

Murphy's law is always in play.

And so it's him kind of, navigating
and compromising for that.

And then you have Mao, who I do
think really embodies this kind

of young, idealistic director
that I'm gonna do it like this.

I heard the stories of how, like, Martin
Scorsese and, you know, Michael Bay and

how they get it done and that's gonna
be who I am and I'm gonna man this and

this and they, then they get kind of
like a serving of humble pie and start

to, realize how to navigate things.

But then I very much run into the
type that's like, first version of

Higurashi that we get where, you
know, they are very demanding and

talk to people in a certain way.

And those are the people that don't
last, you know, those are the people

that kind of don't realize that
film is as exactly as one cut shows.

It's a very collaborative medium,
you know, it's one where you

have to compromise and improvise
and all that, so I, I like that.

I do like how it's, you know, related back
to the family message and this casting

crew coming together, people getting their
shot, you know, their big shot because

it's not just Mao and Takayuki, but we
see it in, you know, other people such

as assistant camera, with her very funny
bit later on with her pop and zooms and

all that it's really, I like watching
things like this and reading things

like this because I can always tell,
yeah, this guy has some more stories.

They've been in the film
industry a long time.

I see you.

I recognize what's going on here.

Emily: yeah, and this wasn't it wasn't
dramatized in ways that, like, a

lot of other, like, documentaries or
movies about movies or whatever, you

know, like, there's always this, these
elaborate dramas of these, like, 3 main

characters that are however involved.

And in this case, it was so, tight,
like, it was and it was also, it

had a lot of situational humor.

It reminded me of, like, the wholesome
version of that show, The Curse, and

the other thing that the guy from
The Curse did, I can't remember his

name, but it's like that very awkward
meta reality show kind of thing.

But in this case, it was like, 100
percent wholesome, and like, you,

like, I cried at the end, like, I
was not expecting this and Train

to Busan to be the other two movies
that I have cried, two zombie movies.

I cried to Shaun of the Dead because Simon
Pegg did a really good job being sad, but

this movie, crying for a very different
Different kind of tears, similar situation

where it's about a dad and his daughter,
but in this case, it's not like, wrench

out your heart and stomp it on the floor.

It's, it's like, hey, things are,
you know, these are possible.

Jeremy: but I love, I love the dad
and daughter story, particularly I

love the payoff of that story, which
is like, we, we see that final shot

when we see the movie and we know that
like, they do the big, pull up and out

so that we can see her in the star.

And then like, halfway through filming.

The movie, they take out the crane,
the crane gets completely wiped

out and they can't do that shot.

And it's like, well, I
know they did the shot.

How did they get the shot?

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: you know, it ends up paying
off in this, like, the people are.

stacking themselves
into a pyramid on there.

You know, at, the daughter's direction.

And, uh, the one assistant
director keeps falling off.

And, uh, you know, at at the last minute
he has to the dad has to run in and

hold her on his shoulders to do it.

And I was like, Oh, they got me.

They got me on that one.

Kevin: So,

Emily: Yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Kevin: even better about that, like,
when we're talking about, like, the

character growth and, like, how little
time they have to work, but, like, The

human pyramid thing is inspired by the
picture that he has in his script of

him and the daughter, and he puts the
picture in his script because the, the,

the alcoholic actor shows him that he
always has a picture of his daughter

in his script, but he's telling him
in a way because he's like completely

fouled his daughter and he doesn't
really have a relationship with her.

And so the director's just like,
man, I gotta be the opposite of that.

And then she sees that and it pays off.

And so like, it's like very
little things that pay off huge.

And it's like, incredible.

Yeah.

Jeremy: Yeah.

I mean, speaking of Shaun of the Dead, it
has that similar tightness of just like,

there's so many, like setups and payoffs

throughout the thing.

Jay: I think that moment with the pyramid
is also great kind of symbolically because

it's almost like, uh, you know, here's
the The dad lifting up like the next

generation of filmmaker in the family for
the daughter, you know, Just as an aside,

the very first time I watched the film, I
don't think I really noticed how unstable

that kind of that kind of aerial shot
was when I first, when I watched it time.

Coming back the second time, I definitely
noticed, I'm like, yeah, this is

people passing a camera up on the
pyramid, and it's just really shaky.

Yeah.

Michael: the, the human pyramid because
it also is everyone is forming that

the, the producer, like everyone
there is forming that pyramid.

Jeremy: the star who's, been sort of
like, he's been a bit of a prima donna

up to that point, like, gets in there and
holds the other people up on his back.

Emily: Yeah.

Kevin: everyone's attitude leading
into this thing is like, let's go

crap this out and cash the paycheck.

And now it's just, you

Jay: It's still done in a, in a,
in a great way because it's not

like Koki or Zakrin or anything.

Everyone's like in pain and
strained and all of that, you

Emily: Well, everyone's trying really,
you can see everyone's trying really hard.

And then you can also see that the actors
that are playing the, director is playing

the director is playing the director,
the, the, the wife and everything.

They're having a good time and I
think 1 of something, any sort of

art form you know, if, if you could
tell that someone's having a good

time doing it, that's infectious.

That's a really big indicator.

You know, that's, that's something
that will come across, whether

it's like drawing scales or,
pretending to tell horror stories.

Like, now with her, like, her, like,
code switch of like, operatic, no actor.

She's like, back in the
day, and the unit 731.

And then everyone's like, Okay, and
then you also find out that they're

ad libbing most of that, and that's
why everything is so like, yeah, And

then you got this kind of Blair Witch
Project situation going on where they're

like, oh, uh, do this, make it up.

And yeah, it's a lot of fun.

And it's also not It's, it's not
rote, like, it doesn't feel Like,

it's hitting on the exact same kind
of feel good beats that I would

expect, especially in this situation.

And so when the movie comes back
around to me and is like, Aw, I'm

like, yeah, yeah, this isn't hokey.

Like you said, it's not,
it's, it's not hokey.

It's, feels genuine.

which is another hard
thing to do with parody.

Michael: Yeah.

And there's no, like,
there's no actual antagonist.

The antagonist is just situations.

Uh, so it's very interesting to
watch them come together because

there's no one to like root against.

You're rooting for every single
person here to be able to pull it off.

Jeremy: The closest we have to an
antagonist is the tiny woman who's the

producer for the network, who they're
just like, I hope she doesn't realize

how badly we're fucking this up.

Kevin: I was going to say the, the, uh,
the antagonist is apathy because she

just kind of like falls asleep during
it and she's just like, great job.

Bye.

Emily: Oh yeah, she's like
on her phone and everything.

Jay: yeah, that very real kind of
studio presence that, you know, I do

think it's a great example and, you
know, it's funny because horror movies

do use this idea often of like the
antagonistic force where there's not

really anything to fight, not a specific
like enemy or anything like that, but it

is like the collection of circumstances.

You see it in disaster movies, you
see it in horror movies, right?

Arguably it's present in a lot more.

Movies and that even when you do have an
antagonist, but it's interesting because

at like the heart of it it's not really
a horror movie at the end of the day

Emily: Mhm.

Jay: And arguably, you know the
curse does serve as an antagonistic

person the first Third of it.

But then yeah, we do see it come about
and just all the, the endless impossible

circumstances that they face and kind
of trying to get this film together.

And I agree.

I agree that we're really
kind of pulling for everyone.

And and it's interesting because we kind
of know that, that they make it because

we did see the film, the finished film.

but we're still like, come
on, you got to pull this off.

You got to do it.

Jeremy: actually kind of
interesting because I feel like.

And we sort of touched on this a
little bit that like your impulse when

you see the movie the first time is
kind of like Well, that was mediocre.

Like, that was an OK horror movie.

You know, it's a real B movie.

And then, like, you're just so rooting
for them by the end of the movie.

You're like, yeah, make that OK movie!

Like, you've got this!

Because it, I think one of the ways
in which it's not like a lot of,

horror movies is, or a lot of movies
about movies is that like those movies

are so sold on the magic of movies.

And, you know, in this case,
like, we don't even know what

the audience's reaction is.

We don't know if anybody watched it.

We don't know if it was great.

Panned.

We just know, like they really worked
their asses off and came together to

make this pretty mediocre zombie movie.

And like it brought them all closer
together and, and helped them to grow.

And like, that's, that's the
magic of the movies in this case.

And there's very, it's very unlikely
there were a lot of people outside

of the set that we're inspired
by this to go do great things.

Kevin: I can't imagine there
was much of an audience.

I wish I had written it down,
but I'm pretty sure they're like,

it's, it's on at like 1pm on a
weekday and it's a half hour long.

Like what?

Emily: Yeah.

Yeah.

That's

Jay: it, it seems like a pretty, a pretty
good time to, to segue to, to how I

came to, like, engage with this film.

It's, it is a little bit of a shame
that B couldn't join us tonight

because they know their story.

But back in as, as like my second
or third year and film school and me

and my best friend had written like
the zombie film, a zombie movie,

or it was like zombies were like.

The big thing, and it was just at the
edge of, of, of, you know, before we

got super flooded with the trend and,
people got sick of it and we had written

a zombie web series essentially, a
seven episode web series but I call it

a movie because it was like a 45 page
script and the way things were planned,

we ended up only having four days to
shoot it, which is a really insane,

impossible schedule that, No one should
ever attempt, like, at all, right?

And and we had to do it for cheap.

I, I, I think, I think our
budget was, like, 10, 000.

I ended up around 9, 000 and even that was
like kind of going over the line, right?

The series is still around on YouTube.

I kind of don't mention it
by name or anything anymore.

And I, I, I kind of knew that's
what it would be like, student

film project, all that stuff.

And so, you know, I had
contacted some actors.

A lot of them, I had, Some of them
I was meeting for the first time.

You know, some of them were
like friends and all that.

Real kind of friends and family
effort pulling everything off.

And so we kind of knocked
it out in these four days.

Got all seven episodes of it done.

And.

It wasn't even as smart as One Cut of the
Dead where, the bulk of the film is shot

in one location that you can work around.

We had, like, multiple locations.

We went from, like, a supermarket
to a mini mall to, tunnels and the

Jersey Shore and all the insanity
over the course of the film.

Great special effects team,
really good special effects team.

Everything was practical though,
so it took You know, hours to

pull everything off and, we were
just working for an insane amount

of time and I had completed it.

I had shown a cut of it at
Intervention to, Bea and a

couple other webcomic friends.

And then I had released it,
like, the following year after

more post production stuff.

And it was really, like, a team effort
and everyone being, like, super full and

ready to get down and dirty to pull it
off, which is not something you commonly

encounter on film sets like that, right?

And after I was done with it, I didn't
want to, like, Touch or look at or think

about zombies ever again, like, like
ever again, and then ironically, I, I

think one or two years later, I also had
another friend in film school who wanted

to shoot his own zombie movie and, even
though it had a bigger budget and was a

little better planned, it was a similar
thing where I think I went on and whatever

role I was supposed to do was not the
role that I performed on that movie.

I was like supposed to, I was, I was
the producer and then I was camera

assistant and then eventually I'm
like one of the zombies in the movie.

and it's like freezing cold in the middle
of New Jersey, uh, at an abandoned bank,

and we have this very real threat of
using this bank vault that if anyone got,

like, sealed in there, then they would
be trapped, kind of, forever, and so

that was a huge threat the entire film.

We had a live gun on set, so, you
know, very dangerous circumstances.

And so if shooting my own zombie movie
wasn't enough to make me sick of it,

that one definitely made me want to
stay far the fuck away from it, right?

And so, One Cut of the Dead people,
my friends have gotten on me to

watch it, and they're like, Oh, you
definitely need to check this out.

And I'm like, Dude, if you know
what I've been through, you

would not tell me to do that.

I, I'm just done with zombies, right?

And then, finally, I'm
watching it and I'm like, Oh.

I'm done.

Wow, that's just like me.

For real, for real.

I can't.

Jeremy: Mm-Hmm.

Jay: This is like my life story.

This is everything I went through.

So, seeing something so similar to
circumstances I had been under, not

like once, but twice, I think that was
a, a, a nice therapy session for me.

Emily: Yeah.

For sure.

Yeah.

I could see how exactly
how that'd be cathartic.

And, somebody is also telling this
story that is an important story for

people to understand, which is, you
know, movies, a lot of times when

we're telling a story about a story.

It's a story that a lot of people know
or care about, and what's important about

One Cut of the Dead is that it's not
important, there was a very ambitious

idea that they were going to do one
cut zombie fight or whatever, and live

stream and all this kind of stuff.

But, what ended up happening was.

Mediocre, but I don't, like, it's,
it's not about the product in that

case, you know, especially with
a with a production like that.

And it, you know, it does make me
like, I see David Lynch's Dune in

a similar light where it is just
like knowing the story behind it.

Is better than the actual movie, but
the movie itself is so, like, the movie

itself is whack enough that I could
be like, I, you know, I love that,

like, I love the vibes, but like, I
won't be like, yeah, this movie is

the best movie, you know, the movie
has some very significant flaws, but.

the important part is the
story about that movie.

And they, I mean, they did Hodorowski's
Dune, which never actually became a

movie, but everybody's obsessed with
like the possibilities that that was.

And, you know, and, and I'm sure that
you could make a really great meta movie

about a movie that doesn't exist, that was
supposed to be like the coolest shit ever.

But and that's the thing
that like aspiring artists.

And what I should say is
respiring professionals have to

face eventually is that it's not
going to be how you imagined it,

Jay: yeah,

Emily: what, and, you know, and you
have to, you have to come to terms

with that because either, you know,
you don't have the resources, you don't

have the, the skill you know, you have
this grand idea and you sort of are

living in the future where it's great.

And you're, you know, you kind
of disregard all of the shit

that you need to do to get there.

Like, all the failures
that needs to happen.

Jay: that's a great point.

I think it goes back with curtain in
another interesting way because usually

when you do have movies about making
movies they get lost in a lot of like

the spectacle spectacle of it and they
become huge narratives of themselves

and I'm not knocking these movies
because I really like them but like,

Singing in the Rain and Tropic Thunder
would be my go to examples, right?

I think they're both fun movies, right?

But You get this meta narrative
where everything is just so grand

and big in and of itself, right?

And then One Cut is a lot
closer to the reality, I think.

And I once heard I believe it was,
uh, Simon Kinberg, who's been on

like a lot of X Men and all that.

He, he's like, and did the original Mr.

and Mrs.

Smith.

He says, you know, no one sets
out to make a bad movie, right?

Everyone is setting out to make the best
thing that they possibly can, right?

And I, and I, and I think One Cut is
very kind of real and honest about

that aspect of it in a way that a lot
of movies are about making movies that

are afraid, are afraid to be, I think.

Emily: yeah,

Kevin: I think actually that's a funny
point, like one of the things that

like when I first watched it, I didn't
like about the first act is because I

felt like there were moments where I'm
like, is this supposed to be funny?

Like, why is this happening?

And like without the explanation,
it just felt I was just

like rolling my eyes at it.

I mean, of course.

Attitude completely changes when you
see the whole thing, but like going

back, you know, there's the movies
about movies and this is kind of, I

don't know why, but this was making me
think about one of my other favorite

movie genres is movies about bands.

And there are very few good ones.

There are very few, but one of my favorite
things from one is the, uh, Alex Proyas,

who did the first Crow movie in Dark City.

He did one called Garage Days.

and you get through the whole movie
with this band and their interpersonal

relationships and like the whole and
the recording and the whole thing and

you get to the end of the movie and
you finally like you finally actually

hear what the band sounds like they've
somehow skirted around that the entire

time and they're terrible and that is
so funny to me this is just like an hour

and a half or two hours of your life
following these people in this band and

you finally hear like the original song
they've been working on the whole time

and it is so bad it's incredible I love it

Emily: I've never heard of that 1.

I'm going to, I have to

Jay: That sounds, yeah,
that sounds pretty cool.

Kevin: It's okay, like, I recommend
checking I haven't seen it in years,

so like, if if you watch it and hate
it, like, I'm sorry, but like, I

do recommend seeing it if you just
like that kind of thing, you know?

Emily: That sounds good.

Go ahead.

Mike.

Michael: was going to say, I was going
to throw out since we're talking about

movies about movies and movies about
bands and kind of expanding that.

Honestly, I think this might hone closer
to something like Noises Off, where,

because it being a 30 minute, like one
take, it's a lot closer to live theater.

So, I think something like Noises Off,
which is a farce about like a play

that goes wrong or there's literally
a play called The Play That Goes Wrong

that's about like that kind of like
acting troupe, theater troupe trying

to pull off the impossible, which
is just to finish the show and have

the audience not realize how, how
far things have gone off the rails.

Emily: that's awesome.

I don't think I've heard of that 1 either.

But that's a, that's a play in it.

You can actually see that
in that's a, that's actual.

Play that's been in theaters.

Michael: The play that
goes wrong is a play.

Noises Off is also a play, but was
actually adapted into a movie in

the early 90s starring John Ritter.

And, um, uh, it's one of those
movies that's got a really good cast.

I can only think of John Ritter
at the moment, but he's enough.

He is enough.

Jay: Yeah.

Emily: Right now

Jeremy: I guess, you know, we
can get into a little bit of our

,
our questions about our,
progressive politics here.

I don't think just based on, on what
we have in the film that there's

a ton of room for them to really
have done a lot with racial and

social justice here because it is a
movie about making a zombie movie.

Although there is, there is a great
line where the The actor is like, Oh,

you know, this is really about this is
really about race and, and oppression and

Emily: Oh

yeah!

Jeremy: is the, I guess he's like the
playing the assistant director and it

is like, wait, how is it about that?

Can you show me that part?

Michael: Yeah.

Emily: How is this about racism at all?

I mean, and, a lot of zombie
movies evoke class like, class

inequality and things like that.

And, you know, in this case, I think
the way that it would evoke that

is the paradox of producer versus,
executor of the project, right?

Like, you have the, a producer
with an idea and you have

the people with the ideas.

And then you have the people on the
ground who are making it, and all of

the, the, the problems that could go
that, like, producers don't really

pay attention to, or in this case, but
there's and there's a huge disconnect.

Right.

There, and I think that
that's an important thing

Jeremy: think on the class side,
it's nice to see a movie about like

a working professional in the arts.

Who's like, he's doing it,
but he's like scraping by.

Right.

It's, it's not like, It's
not what he had imagined.

He's not, he's living, they're
living in a very, like, humble, you

know, apartment in, in in Japan.

But like, you know, he's not a
starving artist, but he's also not,

you know, uh, Pampered asshole like,
we often see with director characters.

He's just like he's a guy that's
doing it I mean, you know everybody

in every, almost everybody in singing
in the rain on the, the acting side

and directing side is like, they're
well off, they're doing great.

Uh, they're just trying to be number one.

Emily: they've got this, this incredible
bohemian lifestyle and, there's not as

much at stake for the individual, or I
should say for the, the but I guess for

the individual people that is not about
art, and less about like making a product

Jeremy: I feel like all of us are
sort of in that, in the range of

people that are in this movie of,
of like, we're, we're doing it.

We're making things.

We're not like wildly successful.

But, I'm still here.

Jay: I think, I think that there's
this perception, um, right, and, and

every, every industry is different.

It's not like, it's not like
industries are in terms of film

industry specifically, they're
not universal, internationally,

everyone has like their own system.

So the system in Japan is very
different from the system in America.

But I do think it gives you a very
real sense of how the day to day

life of anyone involved in the
film industry actually looks like.

people have like all these grand ideas,
and you especially saw it come up

again last year during the protests.

Well, I don't feel sympathy for them.

They have like these 100k apartments
and, can't afford to eat, you

know, at Caviar every night.

And I like that's not, that's not
The reality it's very much like this,

where people are always kind of like,
screeping, people are always hustling.

They're working hard, too.

Again, it's not just, sitting
there and coming up with storylines

and moving a camera around.

There is a lot of physical work that
also goes into it, if you, if you want

to be like, a serious kind of filmmaker.

And the people that are directors and
get to sit in the director's chair,

earned their way up from that, right?

Um, but I think even the family you know,
the, uh, Higurashi family show a very

realistic understanding of what that's
like with, uh, while Takeyuki is kind

of consistently working and arguably a
successful director with Mao, Mao Harumi

and Takeyuki, I think they are a real
reflection of how volatile film can be.

So, Mao, the second we're
introduced to her, she loses

her job the same day, right?

Um, the movie was forced to,
basically, essentially into retirement

for a while, despite the fact she
still loved filmmaking and acting.

And I think that's
what, that's what it is.

I think it's, you know, volatile
and I think if you're even at the

level of Takayuki, you're, you
are very lucky in this industry.

Jeremy: I feel like really, I feel a
really strong kinship with Takayuki as

he's like at his home watching the thing
that he's just finished making and like

it's not even over when his daughter's
like, hey, can I change the channel?

And it's like, yeah, sure, fine.

Like, whatever.

Because I feel like that's, that's a lot
of the reality of making this stuff, is

you just want to be like, look what I did!

And you know, either your family has
already seen it, because they were

there for you making it, or Or that
your kids are like, yeah, I get it.

Like,

Emily: yeah.

Jeremy: not that interesting to me.

And it's just like, fine, whatever.

But yeah, that part felt really real to

Kevin: mom has, I'm still convinced
after all these years my mom

has no idea what my job is.

Like she's just like, oh that's nice.

Michael: I mean, it's terrible to say, but
I literally I kind of feel that not that

idea of not being invested in a thing.

Like I just had a graphic
novel come out last week.

It was a work for hire.

Like I, I don't like, I could not care.

Like I still have not
seen a physical copy.

It's just like, I was like,
yeah, yeah, it's, it's out there.

I mean, it's, it's out there.

Jay: Yeah.

Michael: Order it, buy it.

It's, it's probably good.

I don't know.

It's been a while since I've looked at it.

So I, I get that idea of like,
yeah, change the channel.

Hmm.

Hmm.

Emily: days or weeks or months
or years working on something, I

have a lot of trouble interacting
with it after I'm done.

And especially if I'm, like, working
on it for myself, and I have my own

self opponent deadlines that have
been, moved around for various reasons.

And, you know, the more invested in it
I am during the process, the less I want

to have to deal with it when it's done.

And I think that's one of the problems
that a lot of artists who are, like,

representing themselves and doing,
like, online shops and stuff really,

have trouble with and, that's just my,
like, little tiny soapbox I just wanted

to mention because, you're not alone.

But the, fact that, like, the process
in this case, it's, it's about the

process and, it doesn't matter.

Honestly, like, because everything that
you work on, even if it's terrible,

or if you hate it, or whatever,
if you never want to see it again,

was definitely worth something.

You know, there's people out there
that they're, invested in it.

You know, I self published a comic
that I only sold at a couple of

conventions, and then I got an email
in the middle of a pandemic that was,

sounded like a person was panicked.

I have no idea who this person was.

I just got this email saying,
I must know what happens next.

And I was like, aw, I don't have the
mental bandwidth to respond to this.

But if you're out there, uh, I will
continue to work on that comment.

I did want to say in terms of
like, mental health, physical,

uh, ability, things like that.

I did think, I mean, the.

The guy with the special needs for the
hard water, soft water was initially

set up as a joke, but the fact that it
had so much like, it really did throw

the film out of, like, into chaos when
he, when these conditions were not

provided, and, I think that while it,
there's poop jokes in there and stuff

like that, there's a lot of, it's couched
in some kind of uncomfortable humor.

I do think it's important to, to recognize
that this person, this character.

Is struggling with the same
thing that anybody with this

kind of needs is struggling with.

And it's not, if you feel really sorry
for him, and it is, at the end of the day.

That everybody being taking care
of themselves is really important

and everyone being taken care of.

Right, you can't just dismiss somebody
for if they need like, hard or soft

water if they have a peanut allergy.

Or whatever, anybody who, like, watches
a lot of horror should know that you'd

be very careful about peanut allergies.

Um,

Jeremy: think part of the reason that
that ends up paying off and feeling

okay as a joke is that ultimately, like,
it's his own fault that it happens.

It's an accident.

You know, he picks up the
wrong bottle and drinks it.

Um, it's not like anybody being
malicious, which, you know,

would, would take away the.

Comedy of it to some extent.

This is just, you know, just an accident.

Emily: yeah,

Jay: Well, you know, I, I think to
that end, I will say that I do think

this, this crew is very accommodating
to it because they figure out a way

to keep them in and, and, and keep
using them in the film and all that.

And that is not often
the reality, I think.

on a real film set I think, I think
films are getting better and better

about, recognizing people and their
different capabilities and all that.

And when it comes to something like
the water, which is essentially like a

dietary need, yeah, films are super aware
of that but there's other places where.

They can afford to be better, and
they are improving, but I've been

on sets that are, like, absolutely
ruthless where, if someone would have

something like that, then they'll just
replace them just like that, right?

Um, arguably.

The reality of One Cut was that they
couldn't do that because they really

only did have one shot at this.

But I also do think it speaks to I want
to say the kinder nature and the kind

of family feel that it's setting up
for this casting crew that all comes

together to make this film happen.

Emily: And he's, the, his whole
situation is not dismissed, and when

it came up as, uh, in, like, in Act
2, I was expecting it to be made fun

of, because that's what it, you know,
that's in a, in a lot of, like, Western

movies or I should say American movies.

That's what it would be.

But in this case, it was
a very legitimate thing.

And I think that there's some
it's a good discussion of

Jay: And then I'll add in he, cause, cause
he shows real distress over it and real

kind of like, embarrassment and all that.

And I, I think that's a very real feeling.

Like, I, I think totally
different house circumstances,

but you, you feel that pressure.

Like, I'm holding everyone back.

And, the director and all that
is there trying to console him.

Like, you know, it, it'll, it'll,
Hey, you know, we'll get you

back and everything will be good.

So, I appreciated that part of it.

Emily: yeah, for sure.

Jeremy: yeah.

Uh, I guess the other question we, we
haven't really talked about is, uh,

is, is one kind of the dead feminist

Emily: yeah, I think, yeah,

Jay: I think so.

Yeah

Emily: absolutely.

I mean, it's not a feminist film so much,
but it does have even the, I feel like

the, initial one cut of act one was kind
of feminist in that girl destroyed the

shit out of the director and he wasn't
a zombie but he was torturing her and

like she got her uh her like she she
her revenge yeah he got his comeuppance

Jeremy: Yeah.

And I think you know, both the, the wife's
story and this is, is interesting as, you

know, somebody who has sort of given it up
and, and, uh, it's treated, I think in the

second act is like, An encouraging thing.

Like she's getting back in and doing
this thing that she really cares about.

And by the third act, you're like,
Oh, this really is actually a problem.

Um, She maybe shouldn't be doing this.

And then, you know, the, I do appreciate
when stories like this, regardless of

nationality, treat the relationship
of a father and daughter is treated as

something where it's like you could pass
on a profession, a passion, something

like that in a you know, and it's not
just like, It's not treated in the as

a father of a daughter kind of way.

It's treated as like, yes,
this is my, this is my kid.

They're going to, you know, they're
interested in this thing that I do.

Um, I don't want to disappoint them.

And also I want to lift them
up and help them do this thing.

Emily: yeah

Jay: Yeah, yeah, I I think we see a lot
of moments both in the fictional movie and

in like the first third of it, and then
in the final third where the women kind of

really come through to save the day, so to

Emily: yeah

Jay: Even in the second part, because
before Harumi loses her mind and comes

as, this is really outrageous, character
that's a little too into her role.

She does essentially save the production
by giving them, this other actor that

they wouldn't have had otherwise.

So it is kind of a constant theme
throughout the film where you first

get Nao and the makeup artists, and
then you get Harumi, and then finally

you get, you know, Mao, the daughter
of Takayuki will be coming through.

And even the, um, I can't
remember her name, but the

assistant camera, her as well.

Emily: Yeah,

Kevin: Yeah,

Emily: and even the, we have the
evil producer, so we have I mean

she's not evil, but like, we have
that producer, so we have, we

support women's wrongs as well in

Jeremy: Such an interesting looking woman.

I feel like, I don't know if she was just
cast on look, but she, she just has that.

producer, kind of, and she's so
small, but so sort of stretched still.

Emily: Yeah,

Jeremy: fascinating looking woman.

Um,

Michael: I swear I've seen her in
other stuff, but I could not place it.

Um, but yeah, like,

Kevin: yeah,

Emily: She has character
actor vibes, for sure.

Jay: I feel like there are a few castings
like that where, you know where they

just had this very interesting look
that they had to have on screen there.

Sort of the guy that played the
the antagonistic zombie and we

found out because he was like
drinking on the job, had a very

interesting look to him as well.

Emily: Oh yeah, and I
think I've seen that guy in

other stuff.

Jeremy: yeah, he definitely
has character actor vibes.

Um, I guess the one other question is,
uh, I don't feel like it really has any

LGBTQIA plus content or themes in here.

I mean, it is, it is about a very
hetero family as, as progressive

as they may be in the way that
they interact with each other.

So very, very much straight.

I can't think of anywhere where we have
any explicitly queer characters in the

Emily: yeah, yeah, and,

Michael: I don't think so.

Emily: it's something that could Be
addressed, but I mean it would be an

afterthought anyway with the amount of
time that we have with these characters

But I mean they're in media so who knows

Jeremy: Absolutely.

So it sounds like, uh, and let me know
for sure how y'all feel about this.

Do you feel like this is a movie
we recommend people check out?

Emily: 100 percent

Michael: Yeah.

Emily: Absolutely

Kevin: yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean and it
is, it is one of those things where it's

like, watch it, but I mean, if you're
listening at this point, whatever, but

don't know as little about it as you can
going in type of movie too, you know,

because like I said, like part of, you
know, part of me enjoying it so much

is how mad I was the first 30 minutes.

Emily: How confused it was, you

Kevin: Yeah, took me on a real ride.

Emily: yeah.

Jay: I will say that just despite
the fact, the first third is

rough and I, I think this kind of.

It's justified by the last third.

I, it is technically impressive in
a way that a lot of films are not.

Uh, because it just, you know,
that there's not a single, I mean,

I've been, I've been on, on one
takes before and they are brutal.

And so I imagine doing it, but
also doing it and essentially

shooting three movies at the same
time, because you have the actual

Emily: Mm hmm.

Jay: And then you have the, uh, crew
putting together the one shot, and then

you have the end credits of the actual
crew, you know, putting together the

crew, putting together the one shot,
So I do, I do feel there's, there's

quite a bit technical prowess here.

It's just, you know, and I, and, uh, but
that goes for the writing too, because

even in ways that that look rough and
sloppy early on, the writing, Helps pay

off in like the last third and that's you
know, that's really something I I think

a lot of people that go into watching
movies and it's not even really covered

in this film But they're just not aware
of how much work the screenplay has to do

up front in order to make all this stuff
work And so that's a lot of, like, really

kind of, of careful planning on that.

And even though it gives us a film
that looks like it was, like, super

chaotic and impossible to pull off.

But that's a definite recommend for me.

Like I said it's kind of the movie
that got me to forgive zombie

movies after my hellish experience.

Uh, I think it's, um great as kind
of, a family, it's a family drama,

but it's got, it's got a very
lighthearted sense to it, and it's, it's

heartwarming without being saccharine,

Emily: Yeah, that's a good way to put it

Kevin: I'm uh, I'm really appreciative
they put the, uh, behind the scenes stuff

during the actual end credits, because
it's as much as hard work as it seems for

them to make the movie in the third act.

One of my favorite contrasts is
like, during the third act, you

see them like they're outside the
open door and they're throwing in

body parts and splashing in blood.

And then when you see the actual crew
doing it, the guy comes running in

does like a barrel roll, like, so he's
like, I was like, dude, that's awesome.

Yeah, I mean, yeah, it just really gives
you an idea of like, even even like we're,

you know, you look at it and you're like,
Oh, man, that had to be such a pain.

And then you see them actually
from that was probably even

worse than I realized, you know,

Jeremy: Yeah, the way that some of the
behind the scenes stuff, they have to use

a wide angle lens just to get in frame
all of the shit that's happening at the

same time, because I'm impressed looking
at that, looking at that and thinking

back on the different acts of the film
and thinking like, Oh no, they really

were filming this at the same time.

Like they were filming so many of
these scenes with, you know, one

camera over here filming the medicine.

Well, this film, you know, well,
this camera is filming the scene

that we see in the original film.

And like, that's really, really fucking
impressive, especially on 20, 000 bucks.

Like, It's amazing, yeah, and they, they
deserve all the, all the accolades and

all the money and everything they can
make off of this thing, because that's,

it's an incredible accomplishment for,
for a movie about a dumb zombie movie.

Emily: With the budget
that I had, you know.

Jeremy: Yeah well that said,
uh, what, uh, what do we have to

recommend this week for people, guys?

Kevin, do you have anything you
want to recommend for people?

Kevin: I was really kind of like wracking
my brain about it and I think I'm gonna do

like the opposite of recommend because the
whole like and they're like keep filming

keep filming it made me it gave me like
flashes back flashbacks to trying to watch

Diary of the Dead and I I mean like I love
the Romero stuff but like that's I like I

just like I hate I like I just hate when
you're watching like a found footage movie

and they're like Kind of justify while
I'm filming this, you know, I don't know.

I mean like there's there's part of me
like there's there's so little things

exactly like this that I was kind of
Scratching my head about what to recommend

and there's like I just thought of a funny
story of the time that I showed my friend

from dusk till dawn for the first time
and he didn't know anything about it.

And so you get to the point halfway
in the movie and, and, and, you

know, he, he turns and he just goes,
I need you to stop it for a minute.

His brain around the fact that this
suddenly went from like a Tarantino

crime film to a vampire movie.

So, yeah.

Emily: Good.

Jeremy: Yeah, it is wild the way that
movie transforms from a Tarantino movie

to a Rodriguez movie halfway through.

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: We'll have to talk about
that movie at some point on here.

Uh, Michael, did you have
anything you wanted to recommend?

Michael: Yeah, I guess I
already kind of spelled it.

I would say Noises Off.

Go find Noises Off wherever
it might be streaming.

I feel like that might
be a Tubi or like 3.

99 rental on Amazon.

Check that out for some sort of classic
kind of live theater farce for a kind

of similar feel without all the gore.

Jeremy: Right on.

Jay, what have you got to recommend?

Jay: I'm gonna say that I, that I am
having a similarly hard time figuring

out a recommendations off this one.

So I'm, I'm gonna, I'm gonna give like
a, a little bit of an interesting take

here, but I, I really feel, especially
if you're interested in the kind

of filmmaking process and all that,
that the best thing to do, you don't

get them as much anymore because so
much stuff is streaming and digital.

But any film that people love, that people
really like, you should really listen to

the kind of the behind the scenes tracks
that they have there, you know, if they

have director's commentary, if they have
any kind of actors or writers commentary.

Because that stuff's kind of like,
invaluable, and it gives you that

real perspective of what's kind
of going on, behind the scenes

to make those movies work, right?

And, you I would say that even though
it is a totally different vibe and

a totally different genre, you know,
it's not at all Like, One Cut of the

Dead, and do not go into it expecting
to feel good at all, in fact, go

into it expecting to be miserable.

But if you want to see how an actual
movie, kind of compensates for

not having a budget and but still
has to be released and has to get

out there and all that, I would
actually recommend End of Evangelion.

because that is a movie, where, that
production had all sorts of financial

issues, or they had like tight deadlines
and all that, and they still had to make

it work, and as a result, it actually
does come out being a very powerful movie.

So, that would be, those would
be my recommendations, kind of.

Emily: Nice.

Jeremy: Fantastic.

Emily: Yeah, Innovative McGillian
is, is either currently or just

about where it would at the
time that we are recording this.

I think it's in theaters doing a
round of, of theaters right now.

Take care of G Kids.

Definitely a kid's film.

It's not.

Anyway speaking of
Evangelion I'm talking, and

Jeremy: speaking of Evangelion?

Emily: um, yeah, yeah.

well, I had a couple of different
recommendations, but I think

I'm gonna narrow it down.

There's a web series, there's a web, like,
a web reviewer that I've been watching

lately, um, the Cosmonaut Variety Hour,
I don't agree with all of his takes,

but he has a great series about the
Blade movies which I think, especially

about Blade Trinity and how, like, much
of a disaster that movie was to make.

And there's a, he has a clip in there
of Patton Oswalt being like, you know,

that movie wasn't very good, but if you
know all the things that happened behind

the scenes of that movie, it will sound
like the best movie like that, it's

just a miracle that the movie exists.

And, we haven't talked about Blade
yet for some reason, but when we do

you know, if watch Blade, so you'll
know what we're talking about and

then watch the, the Cosmonaut review
because they're, they're a lot of fun.

Kevin: And then they skate uphill.

Emily: yeah.

Yep.

Also, I just re I will say, just.

Rediscovered Neil Cicerega's Spirit
Phone, which is one of the best

new wave albums of the 2010s.

So, you know, check that out.

Fucking, I have never heard it before
as a full album, and now listening to it

as an album, I just started listening, I
was like, this is Like, my, like, every

layer of my being is resonating with this,
like, from the, the 11 year old nerd to

the 14 year old goth to the, you know,
it's one of the, yeah, it's one of the

best Oingo Boingo albums I've ever heard.

So, check it out.

Jay: I would actually, you know, because
Cosmonaut and Variety Hour, I agree

not even just on their Blade series,
but I think on a lot of the stuff I

think, but I want to add in one more
kind of web series, YouTube thing

suggestion, uh, interesting stuff, and
that would be every frame of painting.

Emily: love that channel.

Love them.

It's

Michael: Yeah.

Fantastic essayist.

Like, but it's, it's been, cause now
he's like works in the industry, right?

So he doesn't have time
for his YouTube channel.

So it's been like five years
since his last video, but yeah,

everyone go watch those videos.

Emily: yeah.

The Jackie Chan one, mmm, good stuff.

Jeremy: Yeah those are great.

As for me, I didn't have anything
really, like, relevant to this movie.

I've been watching bits
and pieces of things.

I've attacked my, I've been trying
to attack my IMDB watch list, because

I had a whole bunch of things that
I have thrown on there at various

points and never gotten around to.

Uh, which means, An oddly large
amount of anime is on there.

But, the one of those that stood out to
me and I think is relevant to our general

horror vibe is I watched Memories which
is you know, three short anime films all

sort of, created by, uh, Kazushiro Otomo
and, uh, there's some writing by Satoshi

Kon there, there's directing by just a
murderer's row of people on that, uh, that

movie particularly Magnetic Rose, which is
the one that's co written by by Kohn and

Otomo is like, incredible piece of sci fi
horror that's every bit as, as artsy as,

as you think it will be being written.

You know, when I say sci fi horror
by Satoshi Kohn, it's like, oh

yeah, like whatever you're thinking,
it's that and then some more.

But yeah, I sat down and over
the last couple of days I have

seen both that and Interstellar.

I think I watched Interstellar, and
no, not an anime could be, could be an

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: that could be an anime,

Emily: Well, there is the
anime, Interstellar what is it?

7777 or whatever.

Or no, no, Interstellar 5555,
which is the Daft Punk thing.

That's Leiji Matsumoto.

That's different.

Jeremy: Yeah, but uh, both, both those,
I think the common thread there is they

were both sci fi movies that like did
stuff that I'd never seen done before.

Like Interstellar.

I, I think Interstellar was my way of
like, I like Christopher Nolan, but I

just don't care to watch Oppenheimer.

Like I've seen enough great man biopics.

I, I just don't really have three
hours for that right now, but two and

a half hours to three hours to watch.

Matthew McConaughey flying into a
black hole and like the, the wild

shit that they do in that movie.

Like, I'm here for it.

I'd never seen Interstellar before.

Somehow it had sort of slid by me.

But yeah, Both that and Memories,
which I know Memories is actually

free on Amazon Prime right now,
which is where I watched it.

And Interstellar is for some reason free
on like four different streaming services.

I don't know how that happened.

It's one of the great
mysteries of the streaming age.

Emily: I do have a question for you,
Jeremy, about Capris, because it's on

my list, but I, it says it's dubbed.

Is it dubbed?

Jeremy: it is all in English.

I think it must be dubbed.

I don't think there is a
subbed version available.

Emily: Yeah, I didn't see any subversions,

Jeremy: not stateside.

It is dubbed well, uh,
if that, if that helps.

But yeah Magnetic Rose is
the first of the three.

It's really fantastic.

And there's one called Stink
Bomb, which is sort of wild.

It's, it's like comedy
Godzilla in its own way.

It's like, what if Godzilla
Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy?

But like, yeah, and then the third
one, which is the one that's just

Otomo is called Cannon Fodder, which
is just like a, it's not even really

a story so much as a like, what if
we took this idea of like, everybody

lives is bred and dies for just like a
war that they never see all the time?

What if we took this to the extreme anime?

And of just like, these people just
live in a city that services a cannon,

that shoots a place that they never
see, and all of them do stuff, the

kid is going to school to learn how to
operate the cannon, the dad operates

the cannon, the mom makes munitions
and it's just like, that's the whole

thing, but you know, it's a short, it's
a short anime film, so like, it works,

Emily: and it's, they animate
the fucking bejesus out of it.

Jeremy: yeah,

Emily: It's, everything on that is
animated the bejesus out of, but the,

the cannon fodder is definitely just
Otomo being like, you know what's cool?

This.

And you're not gonna argue.

Jeremy: it's a very like, It's
a tone poem about war, you

Emily: Yeah.

Jeremy: But yeah, definitely
check out Memories.

If you haven't seen Interstellar,
which I feel like everybody

else has, uh, watch that.

That is, I, I will legitimately
say that that is a movie.

a sci fi movie that not only did
stuff that I hadn't seen, but at

one point I was literally, has
everybody on the scene Interstellar?

Michael: I actually haven't.

Jeremy: Okay, there's just, there's a
point in this movie where like, they're

trying to explore this planet, and Matthew
McConaughey just has the most ambiguous

line of like, oh, those aren't mountains?

That like, when I was watching this
movie, I launched up on the couch.

I was like, whoa, wait, oh shit.

Like, that just is such an incredible
and horrible moment in this movie

that, uh, it was just like, Oh, no.

Like, I just, I felt it in
my stomach when it happened.

It was, it's, it's really good.

Emily: I can't remember what
that was, but it's been a minute

since I've seen that movie, so.

Jeremy: yeah, it's it's good.

Yeah, I definitely recommend
people check out both

Kevin: Jeremy, I really highly recommend
you watch Oppenheimer if you want to

watch a movie where every five minutes
another actor that you're like, Oh

cool, they're in this shows up and
then they have two lines and that's it.

Jeremy: Yeah, from hearing other people
talk about it, it sounds like it's

three hours of Leonardo DiCaprio gif.

Like,

Kevin: I mean, that's pretty accurate.

Honestly, I, I, I mean,
like, here's the thing.

Like I, I, you know, I didn't
dislike, I, I liked it.

I mean, it's not, it didn't,
it's not my favorite Nolan movie.

And like, I think a lot of the criticisms
I've heard about it are accurate, but like

that, to me, that was the funniest thing.

Like there's a moment, like, where,

Jeremy: somebody, somebody
said James Urbaniak is in this

movie to me and I was like,

Kevin: Yes.

And he, he literally has two lines.

And then be gone.

Jay: I, I kind of like to think
of, Nolan's Oppenheimer win as

his win for everything else that
probably should have won instead.

Emily: Yeah,

Jeremy: It's the one
that's allowed to win, you

Emily: it's the, it's the two towers,
or no, the Return of the King,

Michael: You

Jay: yeah.

Emily: job.

I

Jeremy: to go ahead and, uh, wrap this up.

Kev, did you want to let people know where
they can, uh, catch up with you online

and find out about what you're working on?

Kevin: Uh, yeah, I mean, I'm not
really on Twitter as much as I used

to be because I'm trying to maintain
sanity, but I am technically on there as

ElectricDracula, and then, uh, Instagram,
I don't really post a lot, but I'm on

there more often, and it's Electric
underscore Dracula on there, so, yeah,

Emily: understand.

Kevin: yeah, yeah,

Jeremy: Michael, what about you?

Michael: can find me on Blue Sky.

Hey guys, remember Blue Sky?

I'm on there.

Uh, I forget what my handle is.

Just Michael Tanner.

I think my search Michael
Tanner is disappointed in you.

I think that brings up my account.

Yeah, that's, that's my social right
now, but you, uh, check out my new

book, which I talked about so excitedly
earlier in this episode, Absolute

Zeros Camp Launchpad, available
now from your local bookstore.

Emily: Nice.

Jeremy: And, uh, Jay, what about you?

Jay: Yeah, I'm kind of with everyone else.

Twitter, X is great if you like to time
travel back to 2013 to the battle times

when everyone was fighting online.

So I have also, I'm also jumping over
to Blue Sky, working on my presence

there, so you can find me jjosephjr.

bsky.

social.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Jeremy: And, uh, Emily, what about you?

Emily: Megamoth on blue sky.

Um, mega underscore moth.

That's a very important
underscore for Instagram.

Um, and for all your other needs megamoth.

net has a variety of links to
the various things that I do.

Enjoy.

Or else.

Jeremy: Or don't.

Enjoy

Emily: or

don't.

I'm still on

Jeremy: yeah, as for me, I am also
primarily on the Neil Gaiman and Matt

Fraction delivery device that is Blue Sky.

I'm just Jeremy Whitley on there.

And yeah, I'm, I'm still on
Twitter and Instagram at JROAM5.

I can still find me on
Tumblr at Jeremy Whitley.

Should you still be on Tumblr?

It should be a question.

Should you still be on Tumblr?

Emily: No one can take it away from me.

Jeremy: yeah.

Uh,

Emily: I will say that.

Jeremy: Yeah, so, find us there.

Uh, you can also find me on
my website at JeremyWhitley.

com.

You can find us at progressivelyhorrified.

transistor.

fm.

And we are also as a
podcast now on Blue Sky.

So you can follow us at ProgHorrorPod
there instead of on Twitter.

And of course yeah, you can, uh,
pick up my, my book, The Cold Ever

After, which just came out now.

And by the time you hear this, we'll have
already been out for a couple of months.

But if you like, uh, if you like
Arthurian romance, if you like noir

stuff, if you like queer queer romance,
or if you, even if you like horror,

which, you know, you're listening
to this now, you probably do.

There's a little bit of
everything in there for you.

please, wherever you're listening to
this, we would love it if you'd rate

and review it, uh, just so we can
help us find, uh, more audience there.

Yeah, that's it.

I don't, I don't know.

I just hit

Emily: There he goes

Jeremy: thank you again to all
of our guests for joining us.

This has been a ball, guys.

This was a really, really fun movie to
rewatch and, uh, a fun one to talk about.

So I hope people go check it out.

Kevin: for having me.

Michael: Thanks for having me on.

Emily: guys.

Yeah, it was great talking
about this, the light of a film.

Jeremy: Yeah, they're not, some of, a
lot of the movies we talk about are good.

Not many are delightful.

This one is truly a delight.

Michael: Oh, we didn't get into it.

Has, have any of you seen the
remake, the French version?

Jeremy: uh, No!

I have, I've heard about it and
I have heard they are making

an American remake as well.

Boy, exciting.

But yeah, I

Michael: I hear the French one is
not, yeah, is not nearly as good,

but the review I, I watched of it
said they couldn't quite put their

finger on why it, but it just like
the, the magic just isn't there.

And it could be, he's like,
could be because I know, like,

I know the twist, you know, but

Jeremy: and you don't believe the French
being optimistic at the end, you know?

Yeah, I don't think so.

Emily: yeah,

Jeremy: yeah, this was great and,
uh, thanks to all of you for listening

and until next time, stay horrified.