al: Hey, just a heads up the episode
you're about to listen to is about Bram.

Stoker's Dracula directed
by Francis Ford Coppola.

And written by James VI
Hart and Bram Stoker.

If you'd like to learn more
about the movie, discuss this

evening, please visit our website.

Progressively horrified.transistor.fm
for show notes.

After the spooky music, we'll
talk about the movie in full.

So before warrant, there will be spoilers.

Jeremy: Good evening and welcome to
Progressively Horrified, the podcast

where we old horror to progressive

standards it never agreed to.

Tonight we're talking about a very
horny movie from a legendary director

and a classic book, Francis Ford
Coppola's Bram Stoker's Dracula.

I am your host Jeremy Whitley.

In with me tonight, I have a
panel of chil and Cena bites.

First, they're here to challenge the
sexy werewolf, sexy vampire binary.

My co-host Ben Kahn.

Ben, how are you tonight?

Ben: Man?

I can't wait for the one second SAF kiss.

That was definitely the result of
just Francis Ford Coppola being a

horny old man to be the cornerstone
of all of our analysis for this movie.

is Bram Stoker's Dracula about
compulsory heterosexuality.

We'll find out

Jeremy: and the Cinnamon Rolos
Bites, our co-host Emily Martin.

How are you and I, Emily?

Emily: Do you remember godfather?

Anybody here remember

Ben: Godfather?

Yes, I do.

Remember Godfather for.

Emily: We have to forget
Godfather right now.

Okay.

We have to.

Jeremy: Are you suggesting that
this is the real masterpiece?

Emily: No.

I'm suggesting that this is of
a different timeline entirely.

Jeremy: Listen, there is a shot in
The Godfather where Francis Ford

Coppola fades from Vito Corleone
mustache to a tree in Italy.

And that's this whole movie

Ben: That is definitely the same mind
that is giving us vampire puncture

wounds fade into glowing wolf

Emily: highs.

Look, I wish that there was a Francis
Ford Coppola setting on the video toaster.

I really wish, instead of like star wipes,
you know you have Vampire Bite wipes.

That sounds bad.

He totally do

Jeremy: with star Wipe.

Especially in this film.

and our, our two guests
first are returning guests.

They're writer, editor, and lead comics
nerd at King's Features t here Tea.

How

Tea: are you tonight?

I'm doing, I'm extremely pregnant at
the moment, which means that I feel

like I should be here to talk about
either Frankenstein or Body Horror.

But I'm real excited to talk about Dracula
cuz it's one of my favorite things.

Ben: Gary Oldman's doing enough stuff with
his body for it to count as body horror.

I think look body positivity,
even when you are just a pile of.

Emily: That's true.

You can't be sexy dirt.

Ben: Yes.

Yes.

if I could interview Gary Oldman, I
would exclusively wanna ask him about

the day he had to film in entirely
buried in dirt up to his neck.

Tea: But you know what I just
realized is that who here seen

Rosencrantz and Guildenstern Are dead?

It's

Emily: been a million years, but yes.

Tea: But like, I've often not
been on boats and the whole thing

about being alive inside a box
versus being dead inside a box, he

realized all of that in this film.

Emily: Yep.

Whoa.

It's all,

Jeremy: it's all connected.

Phil Colson over here on the first time
guest, he's a math teacher by day video

editor by night, it's Ciji McBride.

How are you

Ciji: tonight, Ciji?

I am great.

I am excited to talk about this
movie, which I consider to be

the genesis event for the Steam
book movement and for furries.

Ben: Oh, damn.

This movie supposed to argue with this
movie got a lot of nerds laid . Oh, it

Emily: sure did.

Or,

Ciji: you know that tab
where it's like tunes?

Yeah.

. This is

Ben: a movie where it'll probably awaken
something different in everyone, but

it will awaken something in everyone.

Yeah, I absolutely.

Jeremy: I've been trying to debate how
long to hold onto this joke, but my

favorite thing I've said about this
movie so far is that it's a shame

that there's not an Oscar for most
directing, just for best directing

Cause Francis for does
the most in this movie.

At any given time, there might
be three different scenes being

layered on top of each other, next
to an image of a diary where it

says what's happening in the scene.

Ben: This is the movie you get when
directors get a level of power mad

that you just don't see anymore.

No,

Ciji: he, it feels like an
expertly made student fill.

No.

Cause there's so much No,
there's so much experimentation.

There's so much like you said,
layering upon layering of different

scenes to make a whole scene.

And there were parts where I was
just like, is he filming a stage

play or is he making a movie?

Especially when it came to
the shadow puppets and stuff.

I was like, you could
do that on the stage.

That's a stage technique that
you just filmed and it's kinda

insane, but also kind of genius.

Ben: Like anytime they have Dracula
shadow doing different shit than

Dracula, I'm like, Ooh, I like this.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Jeremy: That was a great
better the first three times.

Ben: Yeah.

Well it happens a lot
and I always like it.

Emily: It kinda looked like the
person who was doing the shadow wasn't

really like, they were just improving.

And so they're like, okay, so we want
the shadow and just so do whatever.

And the guy's like, I'm doing a
thing, I know this is audio medium,

but I'm like doing a very hesitant
like, , oh, he's doing this.

Oh, okay.

Oh.

Oh, he is over here now.

Oh.

And then every so often there would
be like stretching and weird shit.

There's a lot of stretching
and gliding in this movie.

A lot of skateboards.

Ciji: Look, spike Lee ain't got nothing
on Francis for a couple I mean,

Ben: I was just gonna say Dracula
skateboarded in this movie, just

Gary Oldman with the glasses on
that top had is like skating them

Cobble London, cobblestone streets.

This movie is

Jeremy: what would happen if Michael
Bay had any artistic skill whatsoever.

You get a movie like this.

Ben: That's good.

Fight words.

Emily: It's like if Michael Bay,
instead of going for explosions

went for like weird ass editing.

Ben: Before we get into the
recap, I do wanna hood on.

Actual film analysis hat.

It's very interesting seeing this movie
at this point in CO's career, you know,

1992 after he's made so many of what are
his classics, because I think it, it says

a lot about him and just his pure passion
for filmmaking that even in this stage in

his career, you can tell that he is really
learning from and taking influence from

younger directors who have come after him.

And I think with this movie you can
see real influence from uh, Sam Ramey

and Tim Burton in this film, especially
Sam Ramey with the POV camera trick.

I mean, that's straight out of Evil Dead.

Yeah, Absolut, absolutely.

Yeah.

Just Coppel had just a director
always pushing himself and I don't

know, I could see a lot of directors,
you know, shutting themselves

off to the people who come after.

No credit to him for his treatment,
Winona Ryder during this film, but credit

for never stopping being a student.

This definitely comes from the
directing means treating women

really badly and then filming it.

Ciji: I don't, I remember something
about it, but I don't, it was

Ben: the general kind of co Ricky and
style at the time of like, I'm just

gonna like, say some really mean stuff.

And then it's like, yeah,
that gets the sadness going.

Ciji: Gotcha.

The auto premature of our modern time.

Emily: Yeah.

Okay.

Jeremy: Yeah.

So Emily, I believe you specifically
requested to do the recap on this one.

Emily: So, yes this is a film as we have
said by France Ford Cupola, who did such

films such as The Godfather and apocalypse
Now He did Apocalypse Now, right?

Okay, cool.

Yes, he did.

Everyone's nodding.

Okay, cool.

The writers are James V.

Hart and it's based on
a story by Bram Stoker.

Like in the title it is called
Bram Stoker's Dracula, not Francis

Ford Coppola was Bram Stoker's
Dracula, although it should be,

Ben: yeah.

Real missed opportunity there.

Emily: Yeah, the Stars are Gary
Oldman, Winona Ryder, Anthony

Hopkins, Keanu Reeves, Richard E.

Grant, Gary always Tom Waits among others.

Ben: Fucking stacked,

Emily: cast stacked is
fuck cast and a variety.

If anything, the variety in this
movie is represented by the variety

of skill that is present here.

Once upon a time, there was a guy named
Dracula and he killed a lot of Muslim

shadow puppets real badly for Jesus.

Um, However, Jesus didn't save
his wife from dying by suicide

when she thought that he was dead.

So Dracula stabbed a big cross
and drank, drank its blood because

everything bleeds when you stab it.

Ben: That was extra as
fuck when he stabs it.

That was just, everything
starts bleeding, everything

Emily: bleeds in this chapel bleeds.

The visual, the candles bleed.

Extra excellence.

Yeah.

That's the power of God.

Yeah, it's the power of God
um, to make everything bleed.

Meanwhile, London Tom Waits plays himself
as Renfield Dracula's erstwhile familiar

as a backdrop to Keanu Reeves attempting
a British accent as John Harker.

He is gonna go visit
Dracula about real estate.

Harker is picked up by a chicken armor
man on the last leg of his journey and

shit is just starting to get weird.

Dracula is a mummy of a dude with
a butt wigg and endlessly weird

mannerisms and qualities like blagging
shadows and ability to teleport.

John Harker is just like, this is a
cool business trip, I guess, until he

used seduced by three weird vampire
ladies who make him lactate, blood.

But it is not until they eat a
whole baby in front of him that

he's like, actually, fuck this.

And he is uh, he is taken hostage.

Meanwhile, his fiance Mina, who's played
by Winona Ryder, who was also playing

Dracula's wife who died by suicide, which
is, you know, a Ku winky dink, isn't it?

She is real lonely so she's looking
up porn while staying with her.

Hy best friend Lucy.

They make out sometimes.

Lucy has a lot of possible suitors,
including Quincy Morris, a cowboy,

Jack Seward, a poor Little Meow, and
Arthur Homewood, a Carrie Elways.

Jack is also a doctor in a totally ethical
and OSHA compliant mental hospital.

It's not And is studying Tom Waits.

Also, Renfield needs a cat for salvation,
which is extremely, extremely relatable.

So Dracula has bought Carfax Abby a
big lot in London because of reasons.

It's also right next to
the asylum for some reason.

He keeps John Harker at his castle back
in Romania because his lady's gotta eat.

And so he gets going
to England on his own.

Meanwhile, Lucy announces her
engagement to Arthur Homewood cuz

dollar bills and then a giant montage.

Storm hits renfield goes nuts.

Se does morphine and Dracula eats
everybody on its boat becomes a werewolf.

And bangs Lucy in the
Edward GOs hedge maze.

Mina sees this, but
Dracula erases her memory.

Turns out Lucy was just sleepwalking
through a tempus dressed entirely

in red tool just to ride the
round on a stone plinth by a Crip.

That's goals for me.

Also, not only can vampires become
wearables, but they can also go

out in the day because fuck you,
everything you know is wrong.

But it's okay because Dracula's hot
uh, Mina, despite being the Madonna

of this Madonna, hor duality is
not impervious to this hotness.

Honestly, don't blame her.

Keanu's cute.

But Dracula could talk to wolves
and turn your tears into diamonds.

He's also cross oceans
of time to be with you.

Meanwhile, Lucy isn't feeling well,
so she hits up Jack, who is her

doctor, and also in love with her.

Cool.

Apparently his medical knowledge
cannot discern why she has heightened

senses, briefs like a Pomeranian
in heat, and is dressed like an

Easter Sunday table at high tea.

So he calls this buddy Anthony Hopkins.

That is Dr.

Abraham Be Helsing.

Also, apparently Jack didn't
check under her collar for

the bite marks, which is like

Ben: I Oh my God.

Yeah.

I also had on my notes, I did a, he
did a full examination but didn't exam,

but didn't find the gaping neck wounds.

Ciji: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like he couldn't do a full examination
of that day because then that's true.

He'd be seeing an unmarried woman in Yeah.

He wouldn't

Tea: be able to like diagnose
whether there was something

wrong with her ankles either.

Emily: That's true.

That's true.

She could have tripped, she
could have had an ankle wound and

all that lace just covered it.

Ben: He tried nothing and
he was all out of ideas.

Ciji: Yes.

did wanna say I've crossed
oceans of time to be with You

is definitely a pain dropper of

Emily: a line.

Oh yeah.

Oh hell yeah.

There's

Ben: some incredible and iconic lines
in this movie and crossed Oceans

of time has gotta be number one.

Yeah.

I

Jeremy: mean you mean every
time Gary Oldman has a

Emily: line?

Yeah.

Or, or Anthony Hopkins.

Even though Anthony Hopkins is like
totally off the rail, it's like

Ben: how much code is Anthony on

Jeremy: this movie?

Listen, I feel like this
story makes so much more.

With Van Helsing being like a giggling
psychopath because like, that's how

Anthony Hopkins plays him in this movie.

It's like, oh no, your life
is not going to be fine.

We're gonna have to cut our hat off.

That's all there

Ben: is to it.

Well, yeah.

Anyone else seem like Van Helsing
had never encountered vampires or

monsters before in his life and
he is just like, this is his first

time actually encountering it and
he is just proceeding into all of it

with just this much raw confidence.

Well, who has that

Ciji: book that, that big
book that probably costs,

an extra $200 on Southwest?

I mean,

Jeremy: the word I would use is

Ben: merth.

You know, this guy on top of your
shit fighting the vampire, introduced,

letting a bat bite him and then
sucking it and then sucking the wound.

Yeah.

Emily: So then Helsing later on reveals
that Dracula is his like great enemy

from a long time ago, which is like
completely side, you know, it has nothing

to do with anything in this movie.

It's just that Van Helsing
shouting exposition at his book.

Absolutely.

Ciji: That was the moment where I
was like, is this where they got

the plot for the hug, Van Helsing

?
Emily: I can't remember in the book, , is
there a history with Van Helsing and Raku.

Tea: So there's a history in
as much as he studied this shit

for a long time, I don't Okay.

I don't recall whether there's
a specific history with Dracula.

But there's very much a Van Helsing
is the one who knows all this shit.

Ben: Anthony Hopkins definitely plays this
character with the energy of someone who

has spent decades reading up on this and
now finally gets to put that shit into

Tea: practice.

It's like Absolutely.

that Like friend to everyone who
has, who has like spent their

entire lives being really super
into this one really esoteric topic.

And then like, you go to pub trivia
and it's one of the topics and

they're like, my time has come.

Yeah, yeah,

Ben: yeah.

Jeremy: He's playing Van Helsing
the same way that Rachel Wise

plays Evie and the Mummy.

She's just so excited to be here.

Ben: He has my favorite not
horny moment of the entire film.

When Winona, a rider asked if Lucy
was in pain and he just goes like,

fucking, yeah, of course she was.

Then I cut off her head.

Good, you're

Emily: welcome.

Now eat your pot roast like the level

Ben: of no fucks given.

I'm like, I just had to pause
and just like take it in.

That's

Ciji: a great, by the way,
that's a great mash cut.

You're just like, okay,

Emily: back to the,
timeline of this movie.

We haven't gotten to the pot roast yet,
but Van Helsing has just been introduced.

He is studying the civilization and
the civilization that has advanced

together with blood diseases and stuff.

, he arrives into the, uh, on the
scene just in time for Lucy to be

sexually fed upon by Dracula ghost.

It's invisible Dracula,
one of Dracula forms.

Arthur gives her transfusions, it
saves to save off her sexy death.

No one thinks to cover her boob.

And now they're trying to figure
out where all her blood went

because they keep tra giving her
more blood and it's not working.

I don't think they've checked blood
types, but, you know, it's 1800 been

Tea: no, they haven't checked blood types.

They don't check the blood types

Ciji: unless, yeah.

Yeah.

And it really bothered me.

I was just like, what are we even doing?

Did

Emily: types of blood it up

Ben: red and white?

This does take place a little bit
before, like a little bit before

blood types were invented, but also.

I feel like most people
were Yeah, exactly.

Recognized,

Tea: we're recognized.

Recognized as something that
were important to transfusions.

But they used to do transfusions
like this all the time.

Yes, yes.

And it was just like,
like, okay you're dying.

We're gonna get your
husband and or wife's blood.

And then sometimes it just didn't
work and they didn't really know

Emily: why.

And now you're dying faster.

So yeah.

The Lucy squad, all of her mans
give her a whole bunch of blood.

Still can't seem to
shake her sexy illness.

Meanwhile, John Harker has slipped
into, slipped to his escape with the

help of some nuns back in Romania.

And he summons m to marry him there.

Uh, Mina cuts it off with Dracula, who
takes ugly cry to the next level and

Dracula takes it out on Lucy as a wolf.

She becomes a vampire and
an explosion of blood.

And John and Mina suck face, very
chasely at the Romanian shotgun wedding.

Van Helsing figures out that this is
no mere vampire know ferrato on their

hands, but his long lost enemy Dracula.

And he goes full manic,
losing all sense tact.

Not that he had much to begin with, as
we have said Lucy is buried in a glass

coffin in her Doley outfit, and now the
squad must cut off her head and stake her.

No big whoop Lucy dies a second time
in another explosion of blood, but

this time she unceremoniously drops a
child upon whom she was going to feed.

This is just my favorite
scene in the movie.

I just think that this
is really hilarious.

And this whole scene is really great.

So, you know, if you don't wanna watch the
whole movie, check this out on YouTube.

Mina and John come back to London.

Uh, The former having second
thoughts about the letter.

Who has spray painted hair now?

. Apparently the nun spray painted
his hair to deal with his trauma.

It is very what's the
word I'm looking for?

As tortured as accent?

Yes.

Every, yes.

final Dracula hunt is on, they need
to burn all of his stuff at Carfax.

A Abby?

Well, Mina is kept in Jack's
room at the asylum because it's.

Safer.

Even Renfield thinks this is a
dumb idea, but he is mad that

Dracula loves her more than him.

Dracula shows up as a bunch of
goosebumps gas and beats renfield

up against the wall as gas.

And then comes for, he comes for Mina.

Mina begs him to make
her his vampire bride.

And to his credit, this one time
he lists the terms and conditions

before she fully consents.

Only John and the Lucy squad
interrupts them before Mina.

Mina is fully turned and Dracula
turns into a giant bat, and then

a giant pile of rats super hot.

Now that Carfax Abby is destroyed and
all of his dirt got burnt, I guess it

was sanctified, so it's basically burnt.

And his like albino ball Python
has been covered in holy water.

Not a metaphor or is it Dracula
has to cheese it back to

his castle in, in Sylvania.

The squad follows him with Mina and Van.

He's help chasing him across Europe.

With Mina's slow turning into a
vampire her Dracula telepathy makes it

both easier and harder to track him.

So, there are twists and turns
to this very, very short montage.

Then Helsing almost gets got by Mina
and then the Dracula brides attack.

But van Helsing manages to fend them
off with a holy medallion and a fire.

And they eat their horses and
it's very sad for the horses.

And then they dol punch

Jeremy: the horses to death shut.

Emily: They probably punch
right through those horses cuz

they're like vampire leads.

It's

Jeremy: all done in the shadows,
but it does very much look like

they are punching the horses in the

Emily: shadows.

Listen, they made, they, they made
Kean reeves' uh, necklace melt and they

made him lactate blood, so I'm sure
that they could punch a horse to death.

Ben: We always asked what
they do in the shadows and the

answers apparently punch horses,

.
Emily: No horses were harmed during this.

I assume no horses were
harmed during several

Ben: shadow horses weren't harmed.

Emily: A lot of shadows,
a lot of shadow horses.

Ben: I feel like, and then well,
after you get that, that's when you

get Anthony Hopkins really turning
on like the Coke field performance.

Emily: Right?

Well, he's been, he's been cooked up
this whole like, second act of the film.

Ben: This is Anthony Hopkins.

Definitely entering like the swing of
his career that would have him like

teaming up with Chris Rock and just like
whipping Antonio Banderas and mask absorb,

Emily: he's having so much fun.

He also manages to find the brides in the
morning and just kill the shit out of him.

And then he starts yelling at Dracula.

There's a lot of people yelling
at Dracula off of cliffs at this

point, but they are in Romania.

There's a lot of cliffs, there's snow.

And there's a climactic
horse chase on the mountain.

Apparently they have enough
horses to chase Dracula now.

As the sun sets the squad assembles
for the final showdown at the gates

of the castle, Mina Nicole's finishing
blow and they let her dispatch him

in the chapel where it all started.

He gets to be hot one last
time and she is cured a vapi.

Everyone wins except Quincy dies and
fuck that because Quincy was awesome.

the end.

Ben: It's very important that
the movie end right there.

Yes.

Where do you go after that?

Like what happens in the
next like 10 minutes?

Is Winona like walking out?

What kind of conversation
does she have with Keanu?

How does she walk back that home?

My love, I choose to be
a immortal vampire queen.

She

Ciji: fucking killed it

Ben: that very after that was a mercy kill

Tea: at that that point.

To be fair.

To be fair, at that point, Keanu has also
decided to be in immortal Vampire Queen.

So they just have to like
work that out together.

How, who's gonna.

How's it's that gonna
work for their marriage?

Ciji: It's probably one of those things
where Bon Nodo realizes that Kean

probably slept with all those brides.

Oh

Emily: yeah.

And, and,

Ciji: and Kean realizes that she
just cut off somebody's head and

they're just gonna be like, Starbucks.

Ben: Yeah.

. I wanna say there's no way this
marriage can recover, but man, I feel

like if anyone, if any characters are
as repressed and as British enough

to pull it off like it's these two.

Tea: So I kind of like hope that this
is the moment where they realize that

they don't have to be repressed anymore.

And they have like this amazing
pansexual poly of like them and

you know, some vampire brides
that they find for themselves.

And it's just like all real happy.

Emily: Well, I, oh, and
they, they turned Quincy into

Tea: a vampire.

Yeah, they Right.

He can be one of their vampire brides.

Quincy would, hell Vampire Bride.

Emily: Cause Quincy,

Ciji: he is eye candy.

Emily: Like he was eye candy in the book.

Like he , he was just there to be like,
the second that he comes onto that

screen in the movie, they're like, what
is that like, he's a fucking elephant.

Oh my

Jeremy: God.

Can we talk about, first of all,
this is part of an overall point for

me, which is Sadie Frost doesn't get
enough love for her performance in

Ben: this movie.

Jeremy: Oh.

Because her delivery of like running up
to Quincy and being like, can I touch.

It's so big.

Pulling out his giant knife is
the funniest shit I've ever seen.

Ben: I dunno if is

Ciji: incredible.

Yes.

I dunno if any of you read
Regency Romance novels.

Did any of you Okay, well, well I do.

Yeah.

These novels are so horny.

Like reading those and then seeing this,
reading those for years and then seeing

this movie again after so much time
realizing how horny all, and mind you,

most of the Regency Romance offers I read
actually do research and they're like,

no, these people were horny as hell.

They were all kind of secretly
like getting to second and

third base with when, like they
would pay the maid or whatever.

So they were sexually repressed and
sexually experimenting, but only to a

point some people in religious circles do.

Yeah.

The horniness of this movie
is historically accurate.

Like everybody was trying to fuck
everybody and there was so much

innuendo and everybody knew we're
getting married just so we can fuck.

Yeah.

Ben: I love Lucy, like
she's introducing the story.

Lucy is the star of a Victorian har anime.

Oh my

Emily: God.

Lucy has her first

Ciji: harem,

Ben: like five love
interests, arguably six.

If you count Dracula's Wolf Man
form as a separate love interest

.
Tea: I think one of the
things that's really.

Kind of when we go back to talking about
like the ity of this and all of that.

Mm-hmm.

, like this is all coming straight
out of Bro Stoker's own horniness.

Yes.

Um, Quincy is in there because Brom Stoker
had a huge thing for Buffalo, bill Cody.

So you've got this hot cowboy in there
because Brum Stoker was super into

a hot cowboy at the time, and then

Ben: much feels like an the
Eroticized American stereotype,

Tea: There's also the, you know,
the fact that like Brum Stoker

himself, he had congenital syphilis.

And so like a lot of the stuff that's
going on in this has to do with like

his own anxieties about a sexually
transmitted infection that he had.

And oh God, what could that do to
all these people he was horny for?

So I think like when you're looking at
like Dracula stories and particularly like

the, you know, you're looking at all of
these characters who are so repressive,

and I think this movie in part, this
movie in particular covers that in ways

that other adaptations don't, and even
the novel to some degree doesn't or maybe

does, but not in a way that's necessarily
recognizable to modern audiences.

Like this is absolutely
a story about people who.

Feel like they can't be sexual with
their lovers, friends, et cetera,

in the ways that they want to be.

And like how fucked up it is and how
that fucks up your life when you can't.

Yeah,

Emily: It's really interesting too
cuz this movie being Ram Stoks Dracula

in a time when you had a lot of these
adaptations that were like trying

to be more faithful to the book or
whatever, and they would call it like

such and such as the thing, right?

you have all of these references to the
diaries direct quotes from the books and

I don't know if Xendo is a word, but
when you talk about the Bram Stoker book

and the context of Regency Romance, I
mean, you have a lot of very, very subtle

descriptions that very much refer to an
incredibly horny thing that's going on.

But that's the, that is the language
that you use to describe it.

Like, I remember the description of
the brides in the book and it was just

like John Harker being so horrified
that he was so turned on by them.

You know, and then he watched
them meet a baby and he was

like, well, there, there it.

At least I was afraid for a good reason.

There is that, and then this movie
makes everything like so unsettle.

It is like the antithesis of the
text visually, where you have

that super subtle text happening.

And then like bananas, shit that's
like, weird transition, super

imposition, symbolic cuts and, and
like Dracula eyes floating in the sky.

Ben: It is Oh, I love
draculas floating eyes.

Emily: Yeah.

Like, it is so weird and
kind of like, I love it.

Even though it can be really
can't be and hilarious at times.

You know, it's hard to

Ben: just describe the reasons to love it.

Emily: Yeah.

But like, you also feel

Ben: like yours moments.

I also like that thing for the good
adjectives you just used to describe it.

Yes.

.
Emily: But you know, unlikely
you watch Evil Dead and you're

like, wow, this is crazy.

Ah, whoa.

That was fun.

And then this movie's
like, whoa, this is crazy.

And then like, whoa,
that's kind of super sexy.

This is this intense like love
scene, like the scene with Mina and

Dracula in the asylum where they're
having like this sexual vampire

Ben: Okay.

Moment implying there isn't something
deeply erotic about Bruce Campbell

smashing plates over his own head.

I

Emily: mean, okay.

It's a different kind of erotic, right.

Let's be fair, like there's loveless
of accessibility and . I mean, Bruce

Campbell by himself, like a white angle
shot of Bruce Candle Campbell from

just above him just showing his face.

Bruce

Ben: in candle, the candle
Bruce lookalike candle.

Emily: He's, he is the
candle in my in my darkness.

But anyway,

Bruce Campbell's sexy off topic.

Yeah.

Bruce Campbell's sexy.

But the scene between Mina and Dracula
where they're having like sad vampire,

like going to make a new vampire sex
is actually very like, touching, you

Ciji: know?

Mm-hmm.

,
Ben: it's makes you feel, it does
make the strange choice of starting

the scene by having Dracula take
the form of a green stink cloud

Yeah.

I mean, don't get me wrong, it
built up to horniness, but it,

it kind of dug itself into a bit
of a horn hole to start out with.

Ciji: I feel like the green stink
cloud is probably the best choice for

sneaking into an asylum because Oh yeah.

You can just say, well, it was
probably one of the people here.

So it, like, rats would be
a little conspicuous cause

someone would try to get 'em.

But a, a small, those we're
in London, there's fog and it's

Ben: kinda green.

It's definitely a little that
it's green colored, stinky gas,

like coming through the bedsheets
and that he is like, I'm here.

I'm like I don't wanna know
what that room smells like now.

Dracula dr.

Tea: But like, where are we, why
are we assuming it's sinky at all?

Like, aren't we driving?

Just,

Ben: just be purely screen.

No, there's no reason to think it smells.

That is me purely using, like, I mean,
have trained me to be green, equal stinky.

Tea: And given the whole context and the
error that we're talking about and what

they're trying to evoke here, if it smells
like anything, it smells like absence.

Emily: That's true.

They've been basically like
green, like at the beginning.

They're green equals absent.

Ok.

Ciji: I was speculating that it was
green because we used a green screen and

that's, that's the best they could do.

But I'd like the absence
theory a whole lot better.

That makes so much more sense.

they just, you know what we had

Emily: that is.

Tone of green.

Like that's an, that's
an evil shade of green.

Yeah.

Oh,

Ben: green.

Very evil.

That's why they made the,
that Power Ranger evil.

Ciji: I, I have to say, coming,
seeing this movie at 17 mm-hmm.

and not getting any of the Horniness cuz
you know, demisexual like what I, but

coming back to it as an adult and the
horniness just jumping off the screen

and just like you said, it's the absence,
it's all of these things that you, if you

saw this, I think in the theaters around
that time or even on tv, you wouldn't

really get it until you are an adult.

And I was reading a lot of reviews about
this movie and it was, I didn't know it

was a box office hit and I didn't know
that it was critically well received.

I kind of remember it being
kind of panned for some reason.

I'm not exactly, maybe cuz my parents
were just like, don't see that

movie and I snuck a seat anyway.

But it just, the, we don't get
movies this Horny Money Baker.

We, but we don't get
movies this horny at all.

It's, I guess it's more horny to us
now because we don't see it anymore.

But I wonder how horny it was back then.

So I was curious if you guys remember it

Ben: being just, I mean now I was,
she's screwed up too when it came out.

So I don't have too small context of that.

But I do know, I mean like this is coming
out in the era of the erotic thriller.

I mean, this is like in the era where
like basic instinct and fatal attraction

where big box off his hits, like right.

Sharon Stone and Michael Douglas were
being like horny, powerful people.

Lying to each other was like a whole
genre back in like in that era.

So, I don't know.

I think like, cuz I know it's the
sexual content that got it in trouble

with the ratings board and why they
had to like keep trimming it down.

But I mean, like you said I think it
was noticeably horny for its time.

But like you said, this was definitely
an era of where the base was a horny

Tea: higher.

I think it was also differently
horny and I think differently hian

ways that ended up really inspiring
a lot of art that came after it.

And like, every single time I watch
this movie, I think of both, there

is, it is so clear that Trent Reor
loved this movie because you've got

stuff in the closer video that comes
straight out of this movie and you've

got stuff in the perfect drug video
that comes straight out of this movie.

so you're talking about this thing
that, where it's like, like Ben I

think is completely right that this
is, Probably equivalently, horny to

stuff that's coming out at this time.

But it's so differently horny in that
equivalence you've got all of these,

like sheer clothes and the like,
Lucy and Mina running around in the

rain and kissing each other's stuff.

And that's not of this era at all.

And it kind of like marks
this turning point that got us

into, all of this like Gothy

Emily: Victoria.

Absolutely.

Now you

Ben: a little passion that like
Mina actually has for Jonathan

as evidence by how much more
Pat she does have for Dracula.

And given just Lucy's looseness, I
truly wonder if in Lucy's mind it was

like, yeah, I'm gonna marry the richest
guy I can find, and then you and me,

Mina, we're just gonna be, you know.

Yeah.

Good friends.

So

Jeremy: It's interesting to me thinking
about, I think maybe the Horniest

movie of this time, which is basic.

Is so straight.

Even though like Sharon Stone's
character is canonically, bisexual,

has a girlfriend in the story, but
every interaction between the two of

them is shot in a very, like for the
straight male audience kind of way.

It's definitely this movie is

Ben: bisexuality as a way to make her
character both more dangerous and more

titillating to straight male audiences.

Jeremy: Yeah.

And then this movie is so, queer First is
just so queer coded in every possible way.

Emily: Absolutely.

Yeah.

Well, two things.

One, this movie fully shows
Lucy having sex with a wolf.

Man, that shit is like square on screen.

It's not, there's no like excitedly.

Jeremy: Consensually maybe a bit.

Yeah.

But very excited about the

Emily: prospect.

She's got her kids out.

Yep.

She's like riding around in that tool

Ciji: and she's doing sex
like she's had sex before.

Like she is, she's not some shy
Violet who, you know, her first

time was just a couple weeks ago.

No, she's, she's doing it
like she know what she doing.

Yeah.

There's no way

Ben: she.

Had a straight up
foursome with like the Dr.

Carrie Elways and like Quincy.

Oh

Ciji: yeah.

Like Mary Elways wouldn't
participate, he'd just watch.

Emily: Yeah.

You feel like that definitely

Ben: right?

Yes, that feels right.

Richard Grant Quincy are
definitely having a threesome.

Richard E.

Grant is definitely discovering
things about himself and Carrie

always is watching in the corner.

That's, and Billy, Billy

Ciji: Campbell's doing most of
the work and Billy Campbell's

sort schooling both of them on
what to do, especially downtown.

And yeah, Carrie

Tea: always, and using the
knife is like a prop too.

Oh yeah.

Emily: And writing bareback buck
naked on the, in the middle of Aara.

Oh yeah.

Like I called

Jeremy: this one the Rocketeer.

Ben: You'll get that . Oh yeah.

Like Quincy was definitely
showing like Dr.

Jack how they get by out on the trail?

Like out on like in the desert trail?

Yeah.

Emily: Yeah.

This is call this one cowboy style anyway.

When I first saw Branch
Circus Dracula, I was like 11.

And all, I only saw a little, I know
it was my friend that really wanted

to show it at her birthday party.

Oh my gosh.

Actually, I actually, that,

Ben: that sounds like a cool friend.

Emily: Oh, no.

She's one of the coolest people I know.

Yeah, he host

Jeremy: 11 at the time.

I wanna

Ben: wanna be her friend.

Can we get her on the

Emily: podcast?

Yeah.

Actually I would Minion
this goes out to you.

I'll, we'll get you on the show.

She's actually a standup comedian too,
so like, oh, fuck yeah, yeah, So she and

whole her buddies who are watching Bra,
so Dracula in one room and I'm like,

I'd rather watch The Princess Bride.

And so I watched The Princess Bride and
then two years later I was goth as fuck.

And this movie as tea as you said, like
this movie really kind of brought up

the whole goth, like brought it a lot
of that imagery and a lot of that, those

themes and all of that stuff into the
mainstream because, there was a long

time, like especially in the eighties,
it was a goth that was post-punk,

and then it became more and more goth
and, it was less of a niche thing.

And then early nineties,
grunge goth became a thing

and Trent Rener was out there.

Like, I could talk about Trent Rener.

That's one of the subjects that I
can do like a 40 minute presentation

about without any prompt what.

I will say that the imagery in his videos
were mostly Mark Romanek who, is a famous

director that directed like Michael
Jackson videos and stuff like that.

But I mean the perfect drug video
is also based on Edward Gory, which

Edward Gory being like sixties,
seventies, eighties, like standard go.

And it's sort of like a public television
way cuz you had that old like mystery,

Tea: the mystery add things.

Yeah, I love those.

Emily: The animated mystery
openings, ed Gory, and like that

was something like that was the
hereditary golf I got growing up.

So seeing that all come back around
with Dracula and all that with like

the perfect drug video, which is
makes direct references to the Edward

Gory stuff was this like moment
of truth for me where everything

kind of made sense in the world.

Like, I saw the world, like I saw the
matrix code and I was like, that's it.

But the sexuality in this movie, you
know, we were talking about how this

movie was horny, did we see it as horny?

I didn't see enough of it when I
was 11, but when I finally started

watching it later in high school,
I was like, this is the cool.

I was so pissed off during my adolescence
about being like, just I had to

look this way or the other thing.

And sex was just like a
pain in the ass to me.

Like, I didn't give a shit.

There was nothing cool about it.

It was just a bunch of people
pressuring me to, to be a certain way.

But then I saw this movie and, you
know, movies like it and subject

matter like it, and then Trent Rez said
like, I wanna fuck you like an animal.

And I was like, that's interesting.

I don't understand this,
but I'm compelled by it.

you know, There was this, like this
introduction to that part of myself where

I was like, okay, I can see how people
would enjoy this . To this day I, I

still identify as ace, but I'm like, you
know, it, I always did see this movie as

horny, as celebratory, as you know, this
romance, this like gothic romance that

really clicked on the screen, the werewolf
sex is so sexy, even in shape of water.

She like, there was no like, like
wide shot of her banging the Fishman.

It was all like close up and intimate
and stuff like that, which she's

like, it's great, you know, dude,
fuck up a Fishman, however you want.

Ben: Wait, are there no full on
sex scenes in Shape of Water?

No.

It's all very like,

Ciji: oh, Del

Emily: Tora.

Well, there is the, there is
the upsetting sex scene between

Tea: there.

No full on Monster Sex didn't

Ciji: count.

Michael's wife, his little
tiny honey bun booty.

I did not count that.

Mm-hmm.

.
Emily: Yeah, . Yeah.

Well this is, you like the actual
romantic beautiful monster.

Sex was not, we didn't get any wide
shots of that sex cuz they were always

like in a bathroom, full of water
or something and they were like very

close and you know, there was music
and she did a dance number and stuff.

It was intimacy

Ciji: but not, yeah.

Yeah.

Can we cuss audio please?

Oh, oh yeah.

It'll not, yeah.

Yeah.

They weren't fucking,

Emily: they were being intimate.

Some monster

Jeremy: love

Emily: making

Tea: also like the coka was just
too expensive to get on screen.

Yeah.

Emily: We just had this and which is
the, this apparently the, the ASL symbol

Ciji: for, that's

Ben: the problem of director days.

Kalo would've made that co he'd go
work no matter how much money it took.

Yeah.

Emily: Unfortunately Draculas
don't have enough of a lizard.

I mean Dragon is in the name though.

Ben: Yeah.

That was cool.

There's a order of the Dragon.

How cool was Dracula's Twizzler's Armor?

Tea: Draculas.

Well, Draculas Twizzler it's the
muscles, it's the, it's that, yeah.

It's like the ripped off

Ciji: skin.

That's all Twizzlers
are good for is Armor.

Emily: Sos Armor.

Yeah.

Like it looked

Ben: good on that in Power Rangers.

It looks

Tea: good on Dracula now.

I do.

I want somebody to do that as a flame con.

Causes play is just remake the
Dracula armor with Twizzlers.

Emily: Oh, that's really good.

Yes.

And then I just, someone should

Ciji: beat them

Ben: off of them.

Okay.

. It's real

Jeremy: magic.

The gathering looking
armor like early magic.

The gathering.

That's what's what really got me about
it, watching it is I was like, I feel

like I've played this card before.

Literally.

I, I can't stop thinking about that.

And this just image in my head
of Emily as a, as a high schooler

watching the uh, werewolf sex scene
and being like, makes no goddamn sense.

Comps me though.

Ciji: Yeah.

I mean, that was me

Emily: in high school.

Ben: Like, Ooh, Keanu's
gotta go in this carriage.

Where will, what if we gave it some real
bondage over tones of him just being

like centrally forced into the carriage?

There was a lot of
touching, like strong hand.

Ciji: What would Yeah, and I, I'm
kind of in the same boat as Emily.

I watched this movie at 17.

It was just, Okay.

Get to the we wolfing and the blood.

Like, okay, they're having sex, whatever.

When do we get into the vampire stuff?

So I feel you.

It, it was, it was definitely one of those
things that just went right over my head.

I was just like, like,

Jeremy: did you know the
having sex is the vampire stuff

.
Ciji: Right, right.

seeing it again, wow.

30.

Exactly.

Damn.

I'm old.

30 years later and going,
oh , it's about the sex.

It's not about vampires, it's about

Emily: sex.

The, yeah.

I mean, vampires, I feel like two years

Ben: later, vampires

Jeremy: are about sex.

Vampire would really that up.

Yeah.

Ben: Yeah.

Vampire Toddler is about sex.

Ciji: I don't know.

I don't, they play, this movie came
out in the theaters and then it kind of

wasn't on vhs, it was back in the era
when it would go on vhs, like maybe three

or four years after it played on cable.

You know what I mean?

It wasn't, it, everything wasn't happened
simultaneously, so it was on cable, but

even the um, cable version was edited.

It, there were

Ben: like, I think the block
Western Cut was probably an hour 15.

Ciji: I don't, yeah.

I wanna say the World, world
Six was edited out because

I don't cowards remember it.

Huh?

Ben: Just the cowards in charge
of the networks running very much.

Yeah.

Tea: I had this on VHS in high school.

I know that.

I sure did.

Would've, yeah.

So this would've been, this
would've been like late nineties.

so I, I think I'm between, I'm between
you both agewise and also identify as

being somewhere on the, A spectrum.

I remember all of this stuff, but
I also feel like my memory of it

is very clinical and Oh, yeah.

You know, and analytical toward it.

And so, but I just, I remember having
a friend who saw this for the very

first time when we were like in our
twenties, and she was just like, you

know, I just don't understand why
they would sexualize Dracula so much.

Ben: Hmm.

I feel like I now have to
like, speak for the horns, like

of the world in this movie.

We have a lot of a spectrum,
and Jeremy is very married.

I, I need to speak up for like, just this.

I'm like, the Ory motherfuckers out

Tea: there doesn't being horny.

Ciji: No, it's fine that it's horny.

It just was, as a teen, not seeing any of
it and being a grownup and going, oh crap.

Emily: I mean, I was aware it was
horny as a teen because I was like,

oh, this is what Horniness is.

Horniness you know, I
can now embrace my own.

My imagination is the best thing.

It's gonna be like, I don't think
anything about sex is gonna be

better than me imagining as like
a werewolf man or Trent Resner.

Ben: Trent Resner as a werewolf man.

Don't even get

Emily: started.

I I Had emotions.

I was not attracted to people.

I was not interested in
having sex with people.

Because, You should up your blood.

Right.

The genesis

Ciji: of it, like I said.

Yeah.

Emily: Like so it was, it was horny
and it was like the kind of thing

that I thought people thought sex
was because they were so obsessed

with it and it is it is still that.

And while I have the floor, I
just really want to divert now,

cuz we talked about costumes.

Costume designer is a total boss, her name

Ben: is.

Oh yeah.

She's amazing.

Yeah.

You won the Oscar for this movie, If this
movie did not win the Oscar for like best.

Oh, it did Insane.

Okay.

Emily: Yeah.

That's aco, cca ACO Isca
nailing it with the costumes.

Like these, the costumes in this movie
are a reason to watch it by itself.

Ben: As someone who is attracted to
people at the drop of a hat, which.

Fucking strolls down that street with
his tiny glasses and his big hat looking

suave as a motherfucker on his 90.

And when Nona's got her like dress
and her little top hat to go with

it, they are just like some sexy top
hat people walking around London.

Their

Emily: outfits are,

Ciji: I'm telling you, it start
like, I was just like, this is

before steampunk was the thing.

I was just like that era.

Yeah.

That I want I if we were in Bridgeton
world, I would go back to that era,

Emily: these two

Jeremy: kill at Anime Con.

I

Ben: gotta say.

Oh my God.

Yeah.

Last time I watched this movie, I
had an come out as non-binary yet.

So now I watch it.

I'm just like, okay, I understand
fashion and how just orgasmic

everyone's clothes are in this movie.

I just feel

Jeremy: like I have this picture
of, of you, Ben in particular, like

going through both of their outfits
and being like, I want this piece

and that piece and put this together.

You're gonna do the skirt and the glasses.

I

Ben: need, I need Winona Ryders dressed
in a color that matches Dracula's glasses.

.
Ciji: There you go.

So it's monkey gray, like a

Ben: gray glasses.

Yeah.

Would wear dress.

Ciji: That dress you would wear in
the six month of your morning period.

That color.

Mm-hmm.

.
Emily: Yeah.

Yeah.

. Lucy, when it covered her ti.

I mean, even when it
didn't cover, like she was

Ben: the kinda life where your
family just knows to bury you in

your wedding dress in a glass coffin.

Ciji: Oh, oh yeah.

They're like

Emily: her red tool.

I just wanna say her red tool.

The red tool.

The red tool, even with the ti out was
like very, Oracle of, of Delphy, like she

was very like fertility goddess in that.

Anyway, continue.

No, I was gonna say

Ciji: about the costumes is Rita Eras
like 18, 20, you know, and everything the

bosoms were, you know, it was a square
collar where the bosoms were like ti

you know, and then the right, and then
where this movie is set and the Giled

age, it's very much buttoned up colored.

So the sexual repression,
you know what I mean?

It was sort of like in read year,
it was like, okay, we're sexually

repressed, but you see my tits.

But now it's just like, no,
we're just shutting it all down.

And it, and you see that in the movie
and the costumes 100% reflect that.

So when Lucy shows up in that wedding
dress it's so beyond the current

fashion it's, gosh, it's shocking.

And then the red is, Back
in the other direction.

Yeah.

It, she really paint, she really stretched
the two different extremes in terms

of costumes and found everyone else to
be in the middle, but put Lucy at both

extremes, almost within the same scene
and within the same movement of the movie.

So yeah,

Tea: that's talent.

That wedding dress has like,
so many is like taking so many

notes from Elizabethan costuming.

Mm-hmm.

. Absolutely.

And, you know, and so you've got this
whole like Virgin Queen gut thing

going on at the very point where you're
like, this is com we know that this is

completely antithetical to who Lucy is.

Absolutely

Ben: not.

Not the Virgin all about Lucy . I, in
terms of clothing communicating character

I really like that in all the scenes
where she's together with Jonathan Mina

is wearing green is her primary color.

And then once she starts being more
emotionally intimate to her friend Dracula

only with Dracula, does she wear red?

Emily: Mm-hmm.

. Yeah.

Yeah.

She doesn't wear warm
tones except for with him.

Yeah.

Ben: I know this movie, and again, the
movie ends with the tragedy, but it's

just an interesting tonal or emotional
balance making you want to like, you

know, not want to see Dracula be alive
while also through me's eyes like, To

the end, Dracula is clearly the partner
she has the most romantic chemistry with.

Absolutely.

Jeremy: Feel this movie has in a way
that the book really doesn't, has this

focus on like female sexuality in it.

Because I feel like it's very
clear that not just is Lucy horny,

but Mina's extremely horny Oh.

And wants John to like get with her.

But John is like pecking kisses and then
is like, well we can get married, but I

have to go close this real estate deal
first on the other side of the world.

And she's

Tea: like, just let us get married now
so we can have sex before you leave.

And he won't do it.

Ciji: It really does set up his character.

Yes.

Because only a guy who would look at what
Nona Rider saying, I want to fuck you.

And he's like, no, I gotta go, I gotta
go to work across the country would

completely not suspect anything creepy
going on about Dracula until , until he

see him climb down a wall, see a baby.

He's just like, no, like that.

That wouldn't happen.

I know.

I saw the shadow move, but of course.

No, he's too straight laced.

And I mean, I know Keanu.

Everybody makes fun of his accent,
but I think his stiffness kind

of works for the character.

Ben: I do agree.

It also reminded me of interview
with the Vampire where Liad is like

stopping time and like reading minds
and Louis's just like, I don't know,

that's just a thing like bisexual
French people can do , right?

.
Tea: But, but I think too, like
it sets you up as you've got

this hole at the beginning.

Like, Jonathan's in a
completely different story.

He's in Yes.

He's in his like cute little
epistolary real estate drama

meanwhile his girlfriend's over
here in the like sexy vampire show,

Emily: completely

Ben: oblivious when Nona is
desperate to be in a good old

fashioned like Bodis rapper.

Oh

Emily: yeah.

Oh yeah.

Ciji: He's literally, he is literally a

Ben: s

Jeremy: for in, because one, he thinks an
English accent is just British diction.

He thinks he's doing an English
accent by delivering lines like

a British person would say them,
which is not how that works.

But he is literally and figuratively
playing it straight and everybody around

him is just chewing on the scenery.

For all of France, for Francis
Ford Coppola is doing too much.

Gary Oldman is doing so much
in every scene that he's in.

We

Ciji: call that the most,

Jeremy: the way that he delivers
lines like he is Franken Forter, the

way that he says, I never drink, wine
watching that is, is like, oh my God.

He's going so

Ben: hard.

And like we talked about this in our
last Dracula move and the last Dracula

movie we did with Christopher Lee the
role of boyfriend, of the woman being

seduced by Dracula is almost always the
most thankless role in the story maybe

Emily: in real life.

Well,

Tea: one of the things, I think one
of the things that I really appreciate

about this movie, and particularly this,
you know, this adaptation compared to

a lot of the other ones, is that they
actually pay attention to the fact that

Jonathan is also being seduced by Dracula.

Mm-hmm.

, and like that whole, like when, you
know, he's got like three Dracula

wives who are doing all kinds of
stuff to him all at the same time, and

Dracula is, comes in and is he's mine.

You know, maybe, maybe he's gotta warm
Jonathan up a little bit to this, but.

But he is definitely seducing Jonathan

Ben: too.

I really wish we'd gotten a scene
of Keanu with like young Gary Oldman

without the butt wigg and the creepy
and the like, the gross hairy bombs.

Well, like the scene with the razor and
the shaving should have been so homoerotic

and it wasn't, it's still very you.

So

Emily: the way

Jeremy: he razor is so
he's doing so much in

Ciji: that scene.

So much.

I thought about, I, I realized when
you said that, you know, Dracula kind

of seducing Keanu and I was like, why
didn't Dracula appear to Keanu as his

younger self, like he did with Mina?

I think it's because Dracula
knows what Keans into Oh yeah.

Ben: It's definitely that.

Oh, ke so ke keans just
a kinky little freak.

Ciji: He's a closet freak.

That's why he's so repressed.

Yeah.

Like these three women can, you
know, suck me off, but a baby.

Oh, that's where I draw the wall.

Well, he's about

Ben: his freaked out by the baby as
he is by discovering he likes nipple.

Just to be clear, the baby

Jeremy: is not trying to suck him off

Ben: the baby.

Absolutely.

Jeremy: That's what freaks him out.

Not bringing the baby into the sex.

That isn't

Tea: what happened.

I

Emily: didn't wanna lose my credential.

Tea: One of the things too is that this
is another, go back to the book and the

portrayal of Dracula that we see with
Jonathan in the movie is nothing like

the portrayal of Dracula that we see in
the book, but the portrayal of Dracula

that we see be with Jonathan in the
book is literally just Walt Whitman.

So, cause Ron Stoker, in addition to
being hy for Be Bill Cody was super horny

for Walt Whitman and Walt was a much
older man at the time, and like you read

Dracula in the book, he's this older
man, he's kind of scruffy, he's got a

long beard and he wears this real ugly
hat that's full of holes so yes, that's

exactly what it is, is it's just like
this is what Jonathan's into and like

all of these characters, I feel like
every single character that we see kind

of in this like sex, you know, sexual.

For want of a better
word, thra with Dracula.

In the course of the story are
like different parts of Brom

Stoker's own sexual appetites.

But he like split them all
up into different characters.

Ciji: Didn't he write white women like
this really creepy letter or something?

Ben: Letters?

Yep, yep, yep.

Ciji: Up.

Okay.

Okay.

I heard a podcast that touched upon it
and I was like, I was trying to remember.

It was one of those letters
where Waltman was like, oh boy,

Emily: one of Wal
Whitman's top subscribers.

Like he was

Ciji: all to Walt

Ben: Whitman's.

Jeremy: Walt's only fans.

Emily: Walt have only fans.

Ciji: Well, it would've

Tea: fall, would've had an
only fans if he had today he

Emily: would have

Ciji: only fans.

Ben: Yeah.

If you on the dark web, that's, oh

Jeremy: my God.

Yeah.

Queer for Fear miniseries on Shutter.

They talk a lot about Walt
Whitman and Mary Shelly and

how incredibly queer they were.

But because in the context of Dracula,
they talk about how horny Bram Stoker was

for Walt Whitman, and then how incredibly
hard the British government came down on

gay men during that time, and how Walt
Whitman was suddenly not gay anymore.

But then a lot of things started popping
up and things like Dracula that were

like, Hey, there's a cowboy in this.

It's okay.

He's an action hero.

It's fine.

Emily: He shoots a very big
gun and has a very big knife.

.
Jeremy: Yeah.

I, I do wanna say on the defending
various horny bits in this film

the scene with the Vampire Brides
in Keanu is incredibly sexy.

Yeah.

Monica Beluchi appearing in this 11
years before she will try to seduce

Keanu again in the Matrix Reloaded.

Emily: Oh my God.

That's, oh, holy

Ben: shit.

I didn't even that connection's.

Holy fuck.

Yeah.

Jeremy: My God.

She b is incredibly attractive.

Yeah, but she's, she's just one of those
people that I'm fascinated by because

she was previous to be, she was on the
faculty of a law university in Italy, and

at 24 was just like, guys, have you ever
noticed how I'm incredibly attractive?

And just went and started being a model
and then an actress and just left law to

do that . And for her I You're not a boss.

Yeah.

And is now like in her late fifties law

Emily: school student.

Stunning.

Ciji: Right.

. She's probably paid off all her
student loans and then some.

So good for her.

For

Emily: real, for real,

Jeremy: for real.

Yeah.

She just went and joined
delete model management.

Ciji: If I look like Monica Belushi.

Yeah.

Yeah.

All the movies.

Yeah.

Like, oh, you wanna see my boob?

Sure.

Gimme money.

It's fabulous.

Yeah,

Jeremy: right.

I mean, I have very good boobs.

You should wanna see them.

Yeah.

Ben: It's they were spectacular
and it was quite the scene

,
Jeremy: she, she is also the only of the
three drac brides that I'm not slightly

uncomfortable with their use of baby
eating, no sort of ramani dress and

decoration of people and their, their
wild misuse of the term gypsy in this

Ben: really should address that.

There is pretty liberal use of
what is unquestionably sl Yeah.

The gur there, there's absolute
dehumanizing of the Roma people and which

Ciji: is in the book as well.

I don't think you see any of
their faces, you know what I mean?

Like you, they're just sort of, they're
kinda like the Rouss abouts and Dumbo.

You're like, are they supposed,

Ben: like, they're not characters.

They're like, you may see their
faces flash all the actions.

I'm sorry.

Tea: No, that's all.

They're treated in like,
extensions of Dracula.

They're not, they're props.

They're dracula's props.

Yeah.

Jeremy: They're, he calls
them in his letter Parker

calls them Dracula's gypsies.

There's no reference to this being
like a culture or them being ramani

or even the things that are generally
stereotyped about Ramani people.

It's just that like, oh, these are a group
of people that absolutely serve Dracula.

So like they're sworn to
him, he's their master.

And it's like, is that even a racial
stereotype about Roman people that

they just swer their allegiance to?

You know, it seemed

Ben: to be sort of what I understand
the stereotype is, but like, again,

this isn't implied that, oh, these are
like renfield level mental mind control.

These are just, this is just a
dehumanized, marginalized population.

Yeah.

Who, if their faces are seen, it is
only flashing by during an action

Tea: sequence.

Well, and I think too, there is this,
honestly for me one of the things that,

that I feel like is happening in that,
those scenes in this movie is that

somebody got Roma and Romanian confused.

Ciji: Oh yeah.

Mm-hmm.

, that would

Ben: make a, okay, that would make sense.

If they just said, here's some Romanian
people that are loyal to Dracula.

I honestly wouldn't question it.

But once you make it explicitly the
marginalized, like persecuted group,

Ciji: once they drop the geezer,
Your brain automatically, yeah.

Goes towards a certain group of people,
which, if we're talking about, you

know, these people don't, these people
in Dracula don't have an allegiance

to a country that could apply to
the stereotypes applied to Ramani

people, you know, because they're
stereotypically nomadic and they don't

really have a country, so it could apply.

You're good.

Like you said, I'm sure if someone
mixed up Ro Roman and Romania and

just dropped the geezer mm-hmm.

, especially back in the nineties, that
word was just sort of like a blanket

term for people that don't matter.

That you could, that are
just, they're minions.

They're the minions, and you could,
you could throw 'em off a cliff.

Yeah.

You make them do your bidding.

If you pay them, they will
have a lesions to you.

You know, just that whole thing there.

Yeah.

I'm

Ben: shocked how commonly
it's used to this day.

Oh God.

Like the Flash TV show Dad, like, yep.

Here's a character who is the
slur, that's her superhero name.

We're not changing this from the comics.

Tea: Oh, cool.

That's not cool at all.

I mean, I think one of the things that
confounds me about it too, within the

context of this movie is that there is a
lot about A, the original novel, and B,

a lot of the earlier adaptations that.

Is really, really antisemitic.

And I think that this movie does
a good job of erasing most of

the antisemitic stuff by making
Dracula explicitly Christian.

Yes.

Ciji: Yeah.

Ben: I didn't find anything that

Ciji: jumped out to me as

Tea: Antisoma stuff.

Instead in

Emily: There's a theory and anti-Muslim.

Ciji: Yeah.

There's a theory that, yeah, you, far
too many people feel the need that there

has to be a group of people like that
in their stories in order to, you know,

there has to be the, the people that
you know, are the marginalized people.

And it's always interesting to see who
chooses which group and what qualities

to mar to make that marginalized group.

So it's something that I think
a lot of creators do, either

consciously or unconsciously.

But at the same time, it's always
interesting if they're going to what,

like if they're gonna be antisemitic,
they're gonna be anti-Muslim, if they're

gonna be anti-black, if they're gonna
be anti ramani, you know, it's just a

matter of who, who's gonna get, who's
gonna get punched down to in this

movie, you know, that sort of thing.

So that's a good point.

I hadn't realized that they
had erased the antisemitism and

replaced it with anti romanism.

Jeremy: Yeah.

There's also like a lot of people
talking about the Draculas in the

book as being sort of like a bit
of a, a stereotype for what people

of that time would've associated.

Muslim or Arabic people of being
somebody from the east who is coming

in and stealing their women who has,
you know, a dark complexion and dark

hair and is from sort of this nebulous
region and the drinking of the blood

specifically give him like the quality
of like, oh no, he's fighting Muslim

people at the beginning of this.

good question Mark.

Tea: that gets complicated by the fact
that that's actually what Dracula did.

he was pretty much constantly at war
with the Ottomans and it wasn't the

first time he did it, but the reason
that Dracula, the actual person got a got

a reputation as the inhaler is because
the Autumn Emperor sent a delegation

to him demanding he swear feely to
the empire and he inhaled them all.

So he was actually like, that was
literally what Dracula was doing, was

going out there and killing Muslims.

You know, so not a great guy actually.

Yeah.

I think that the fact that it's in
the movie and kind of glossed over is

a problem, but it's also historically
accurate from the perspective of,

yeah, that's kind of what he was doing.

Emily: Yeah.

Although the the imagery of the shadow
of the moon passing over the European

map that is, I think in terms of like
ways that they could have made it less

like Islamophobic you know, that image
of in and of itself is a bit cringy.

Tea: They, I feel like the
problem here is that they tried

to lionize this guy to begin with.

Yes.

And you can't create this like great
tragic romance that, , spans centuries

if the person who's half of the great
tragic romance that didn't happen mm-hmm.

, because his wife, well, he had two
wives, but his, his, the wife that

he's best known for have been married,
having been married to outlive him.

but like this great tragic
romance if one of them is like

out there just murdering people.

Ben: So I have a question about
the theology of this movie.

Okay.

Because this movie, cuz Dracula, his
motivation is his wife has been sent

to hell and that's why he revokes God.

And again, based on the church bleeding
and everything else and the crosses, it

does seem like this movie does that thing
that I guess is kind of inherent in when

they do the crosses weakness, which I
don't always love as a Jewish viewers.

Yep.

Christianity is real.

It is the objectively correct religion.

It is true.

Well, it's how is real?

How is his wife also reincarnated?

We have heaven and hell and
reincarnation in this movie.

Tea: So she

Ben: recar.

I mean, she's got all the past the, like,
the like she's got like the memories.

That's

Ciji: true.

Tea: She does have, I think somebody
watched the adaptation of the

1989 adaptation of Phantom of the
Opera where the primary, the, the

protagonist in it is the reincarnation
of Christine from the nine, from the

19th, 20th, from the 19th century.

So like, there's definitely a theme
in this late eighties, early nineties

horror movie of like, the love of
my life has come back from the Dead

in another incarnation and like
it's our destiny to find each other.

That like for me actually really
pisses me off in this movie because

it's completely unnecessary to
anything else that's going on.

And it's just kind of there.

And yes, it gives us the whole cross the
oceans of blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,

blah, but as a line, that's a great line,
but it doesn't do anything for the plot.

Ciji: Yeah,

Ben: To me it helps sell just how fast
and how hard Winona Ryder falls for.

Yeah, that's why it's there.

It's just, yeah, like I,
I, we need a shortcut.

I like, I'm, I'm totally with you.

It's like, it's definitely this
element that like, kind of only exists

to paper over like the weaknesses
and the pacing of their romance.

Like their romance, there isn't
enough there for their romance to

be that deep, to be believable.

So there has to be extra past love,
romance to back it up, like post romance.

Jeremy: Actually the most,
confusing part of this movie for me.

Yeah.

Because it's one, it's unclear how
much time passes because during the

time that Dracula and Meina are having
a romance Harker does escape the

castle and then stay for seemingly
a few months with these nuns before

traveling from Romania to England,
which itself takes a good deal of time.

Mm-hmm.

, if you are not a weird ghost person
that is some span of time that they're

spending together that might be
reasonable for them to fall in love.

We just don't see it, a lot of it.

Yeah.

And then like, even down to, the
final chase across, you know, to

Castle Dracula, it's still unclear.

Like Mina is giving kind of mixed
signals of like one minute she's

on board with killing Dracula.

The next Dracula is the
only thing she cares.

And I think it's unclear whether she's
fighting some sort of supernatural

influence he has over her, or if
she really has fallen in love with

her, that mu or him that much, or
she just , really horny for him.

Yes.

The answer

Ciji: is yes.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I guess if you look at, I don't
disagree with any particular point.

It's just, I guess if you look
at the sexual repression that

she's clearly experiencing.

She wants to be as free as Lucy,
but whatever is holding her back.

And I guess what was sort of
unconsciously holding her back was

that she was the reincarnation.

She actually had a past love.

So I see what the movie is trying to do.

I don't necessarily, it's the greatest
solution to that problem, but , it

happens and you're like, oh, okay.

I mean, we're wolf sex

Jeremy: and she is literally
a poor, repressed school Mark.

You

Ben: see?

I mean,

Tea: yeah, like, that's what I was
gonna say is that like, you already have

the answer to what's holding her back.

What's holding her back
is class, British class.

Absolutely.

Ciji: and also, and Lucy is clearly
much of a much higher class.

Yes.

And so she, because she's higher
class, she's allowed to be gregarious,

she's allowed, she's probably fucked
both the doctor and the cowboy.

She's saving Arthur for the marriage
cuz she knows he's of the same

class and he wouldn't marry her if
they had, but she's definitely done

things with the other two, you know?

Yeah.

Mina women of Mina's class can't be
that gregarious because she doesn't

have money where people accept it and
she knows like Jonathan's the best

she could do, you know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah.

And here comes Gary Oldman, who you
know is looking how he's looking in this

movie and absent and you know, all he's
just oozing charisma and sex and I see.

And he's a prince or so
he said, you know, yeah.

He a moment where there all guys like
I'm an African prince but like Yeah.

Right.

You know what I mean?

So I'm a prince, like mm-hmm.

Sure, sure buddy in

Emily: Nigerian.

But I mean back in, back at that time

Tea: now I'm like imagining Dr.

Pyramid scheme with all
of those boxes of dirt.

Emily: Right.

Is experimental

Ciji: earth.

What are they doing an experiment on?

Exactly.

But if you think about Vapo Prism,
it's kind of a pyramid scheme.

It is.

I mean

Emily: it's

Jeremy: people, you gotta get people.

Ciji: I made it.

Its, it is queen of

Emily: the damn was

Ciji: Egyptian.

She was.

And honestly

Ben: I feel like that's cannon.

People in London at this time were
just so fucking horny for anything.

A cult that like you could have made
a killing off of genuine Dracula.

Absolutely sell

Ciji: it by the bag

Emily: fold.

I'm certain that a lot of
people did have Dracula dirt.

I mean,

Ciji: probably get a big dog and say it's
a wolf, just, oh, I turned into a wolf.

Or, you know, train a bat to fly around.

Yeah.

I did have another question.

I know.

Yes.

I dunno how this goes.

Okay.

One thing that always bothers me about
vampire stories is how none of the

vampires seem to wanna be vampires.

I don't understand that.

I, they're always like,
this is an awful existence.

And I'm like, is it though?

I don't understand in this movie
why Dracula doesn't want Mina.

I mean, his whole goal is
you know, to get with her.

Yeah.

And then she's like,
make me a vampire too.

It's like, no.

And I was like, well, what
was your end game here?

Like, you were just going to be
Dracula and she be human and she

eventually gets old and dies.

Emily: I think that there's a,
there's a sort of luciferian test that

goes along with this where mm-hmm.

I mean, I don't think that, that
this is especially the script of

this movie, this is intended to be so
subtly diabolical, but I do think, you

know, it is a, it is an archetype for
these kind of characters, especially

characters like the Madonna complex
characters that Winona Ryder represents.

There needs to.

Ben: Francis Board Ka probably loved
the idea of doing the Madonna, who,

but then he realized that meant one
of them couldn't be horny, so he had

to figure out how to do like the, like
the Horny Madonna and the horny who,

Ciji: yeah, just

Emily: more, more horny, less horny.

But I mean, like, everybody
in this movie is horny.

The rats are horny.

Everyone's horny.

But the fact that he
was like, are you sure?

Are you sure?

Jeremy: Consent Dracula.

Emily: Yeah.

He was, he really, like,
they needed consent.

And there's also that scene, which
is supposed to be romantic, so,

you know, it's very problematic.

I mean, there's already a lot of
like, manipulation going on and, you

know, supernatural and otherwise,
but if it's as like, violent as with

Lucy, it's not gonna be romantic.

Mm-hmm.

. But I do think that Dracula is a
little bit of a tragic character.

He does have all this power, but
he's sad, like from the get go, he's

sad and he also looks like a mommy.

It's not until he gets the uh, the
motivation of seeing Mina's picture.

When he is like, oh shit, I gotta

Ciji: be hot again.

Ula makeover.

Emily: Right, right, right, right.

Yeah.

Jeremy: That's how he gets hot again, is
he eats an entire ship full of sailors

Emily: entire ship.

Yeah, like eating all the guys and like
hanging out in his dirt, I think helped

Ben: I really want the version of Dracula
now that plays the romance straight and

it's just like a Hallmark Christmas movie
where like you lose, Jonathan Mina is

the career focused lawyer who wants to
work over Christmas in the city, but then

she's sent out to like the small floristy,
like rural town of Romania where here's

hunky Dracula in his vampire sweater.

And I guess he has a pet wolf that
like comes and interrupts the dates,

but is just so romantic about.

Ciji: The children are the night.

That's, so I have a feeling that's
already been a Hallmark movie, are you?

Yeah.

It's not on Lifetime.

Like Lifetime After Dark or something.

. I definitely

Ben: satisfy something they do.

Like if not, I hope I
want to get in on that.

Like, sweet, sweet
Christmas, Dracula money.

.
Jeremy: I feel like this movie is I don't
know, maybe a peak, maybe a starting point

for a, a thing that's definitely been
happening over the past like 30 years.

And this, I'm, I'm way up on this
peak right now because I've been

watching the Hotel Trannsylvania
movies with my children.

Mm-hmm.

and it's this sort of good guying
of Dracula because the Dracula

in the book is not a good guy.

He is a monster.

He may be a horny monster, but like,
there's not a, like reincarnation thing.

There's not a vengeance against God thing.

He's a bad guy who wants things, so
he takes them, that's his whole deal.

And watching the Hotel Trannsylvania and
thinking about this is a real trip because

I feel like Hotel Trannsylvania is trying
really hard to make being a vampire some

sort of like, correlation to being Jewish.

And that might just be Adam
Sandler being in this part.

Uh, And the fact that they decided
to cast his dad as Mel Brooks.

They really decide that like Dracula,
that's really is, he is and has

included himself because humans
attacked his people and killed his wife.

So he had to go make a hotel
just for monster people

away from the normal humans.

And like, he has to discover
that humans can be all right.

again.

Tea: you know,

I think one of the things you're talking
about, and I think it's really important,

is that when you go back to Dracula,
when you go back to the contemporary

vampire stories that were happening
around the time of Dracula, they were

using Jewish stereotypes for vampires.

Yes.

There were a lot of them
being connected with vampires.

And so what I think you're seeing when
you see something like Hotel Trannsylvania

is, okay, let's take all of this stuff
that was done for the last, century or

so that was really crappy, and try to
rehab it without, necessarily, without

that necessarily meaning that we're
gonna take away the Jewish coding of

these characters that like, we're gonna
keep the Jewish coding and we're gonna,

but we're gonna rehab the mythos around
the characters to make the characters.

You know, and I don't necessarily know.

I think some, sometimes that's
more or less successful.

Yeah.

But I also think that like, when you're
talking about, like, there's another

thing going on with movies like this
where, and I think it honestly starts

with the Franklin performance of Dracula
in the seventies where people who aren't

monster fuckers don't get monster fucks.

You have all of these people who
are like desperately attracted

to these monstrous characters.

And like, I'm sure you know, I don't
know how many of you have seen like

Franklin jealous stories about the
letters he got from ladies when he

was playing Dracula on Broadway,

Cause they're horny as heck.

Yeah.

And,

Ciji: and what?

Oh,

Ben: I, I bet.

And

Tea: so you get this bridge
from, okay, we know that people

are attracted to these horrible
monsters, so let's make the monsters

attractive to vanilla people now too.

Mm-hmm.

because they don't quite get what's going
on there with that, you know, oh wow.

It's really hot when, you know, Lucy gets
together with the Wol version of Dracula.

Why are people so horny for this moment?

So then they.

Go back and decide that they're gonna
make Dracula a nice guy so that they can

understand why people are so horny for it.

Emily: Reverse engineering monster.

Fucking, yeah.

Jeremy: I, I think it's really weird
in this movie in particular because he

comes off to me as the weirdest sort of
pickup artist, which is like, comes to

England specifically because he wants
to get with Mina and his first step in

doing this is to seduce her best friend
and fuck her as a wolf in the garden.

And it's like, and then make her

Ciji: forget.

Yeah.

And then

Ben: ask for directions
to the movie theater.

Tea: His first move though is
really seducing her fiance.

We just don't know much of

Ciji: it's Well, he didn't know that there
were, there were No, but yeah, he picked,

he wanted Harker to He was wanted Harker.

Yeah.

And then he was like, oh wait,
this dude knows my old lady.

Oh, so two for one, here we go.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jeremy: Made his picture
instantly forgot about Harker.

He was like, oh, can I just
leave you here in this castle?

Could you write some suicide notes for, I

Ciji: honestly think he was planning
on going to get Mina, bring her back.

Mm-hmm.

three something.

Cause he was like, lady,
I agree, one is mine.

After he knew about Mina and
he was like, no, I'm a y'all.

Keep him busy.

I'm gonna go get the other chick.

And then we all, it's

Ben: gonna be a party.

Wasn't tell that about Mina
until after Harker got.

Why was Dracula buying all that property?

Ciji: Cause he wanted to go to big city.

Look, it's, it's the
time to buy real estate.

I mean, it's only gonna go up.

It's just, he's just amazing.

Tea: He lived like alone in this
really remote castle in Romania.

There was no snacks,
there was no ethnic food.

Like he couldn't get takeaway anywhere.

So he has to go somewhere where he can
like, actually like, have like a life and

like lots of little tasty treats cuz you

Ciji: got Rich Dad know.

And he was like, I gotta
go into real estate.

this is a

Ben: Dracula culture.

He's gotta be where the
culture's getting made.

He was

Ciji: like, and

Emily: that's why he
hired a property brother.

Tea: Right.

He was so bored in his castle that all
he was doing was watching house flipping

shows and it just like got to him.

Jeremy: Honestly.

What's more va pric than
becoming a landlord?

Ciji: Right?

Jeremy: He didn't buy one,
he was buying 10 properties.

Oh yeah.

He's at his own Abby.

And then nine, nine properties that
he's making money off of throughout.

If

Ciji: you reevaluate this movie as a
cautionary tale about the pitfalls of real

estate development and lording, I mean.

Emily: Yeah.

that's some of what the book is about,

Ciji: but true,

Emily: that's true.

. Cause the real estate thing
was very prominent in.

The book did not have so much
of, you know, where of sex.

It was just like a lot of people
being like, and I was compelled,

Ciji: I'm winking well in the book.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I
haven't read in a long time.

He's buying these places strategically
to create, to like, isn't he buying

these, aren't there some sort of method
to the places that he's buying to

sort of triangulate Mina or something?

I think am I, I remember that wrong.

Go ahead.

Tea: T yeah, I mean he's, he's
triangulating properties, but I don't

think it's with the, I don't think
when he's initially doing it, it's

with the goal of a specific person.

Mm-hmm.

It's more, it's more that
he wants to come to London.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's really, it's really more this idea
of the, you know, you've got this Eastern

European and you know, again, like Jeremy
was saying earlier, either, depending

on how you're reading it, anti-Muslim or
anti-Semitic stereotype of this character

who is the immigrant character coming
in and stealing our property money.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

. Yeah.

And that's really what
you're seeing there.

So there's this whole other,
there's this whole father metaphor

going on in the book that is about
like, you know, that's about.

Outsiders coming in and taking our land.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Ciji: Which was something.

And at the time, people built their
wealth, especially during the Gil at

age, because you have all this old
money that is running out of, you have

these people with and land that are
running out money and they're like,

we want all this foreign, sort of like
what's happening in America right now.

But there's just like,
we need all this money.

And so we will let in an immigrant,
we've been let in a Muslim, we will let

in a foreigner, we will let somebody
who we code as Jewish, even though we

would let them into our upper echelons
of society because they can afford it.

Yeah.

I, I, I I see what you mean.

Yeah.

That

Jeremy: makes total, yeah.

What I'm hearing is that
then Helling is a Brexit, so

Emily: Oh, damn German.

Tea: Damn.

But Dan Hsing is actually
based on Teddy Roosevelt's.

Uncle . True.

Ben: That's crazy.

Y'all.

What accent was Anthony Hopkins doing?

And I know it's a trick question because
he never did the same accent twice

Ciji: European.

The accent is, the accent is I
just did decided of the lambs and

now y'all know who I am and I'm
gonna do whatever the fuck I want.

Exactly.

It's that what that accent is.

And rabies, you rabies
the rest of the movie.

He plays it like he's about
to drop dead of rabies.

Oh.

And it makes.

Well, and, and Coke.

All the

Jeremy: Coke in the movie.

Cause Van Helsing has some of
these moments where he is like,

we're gonna kill Dracula, but
First man, I am so fucking hungry.

Can we get some food like that?

Literally, that's what Van
Helsing does in the movie.

He's like, all right, we gotta plan.

I've gotta eat first Man.

Anybody else wants some
fried chicken right now?

Like

Ben: he has wine.

Like Yeah.

Where he is like if, like, I
think at one point he calls Lucy

like a bitch of the dead bitch.

Which of the knight?

Ciji: What is it?

The Bitch to the Knight or something.

Ben: Oh, I thought it
was Bitch of the Dead.

Which I'm like, that needs
to be a bad name like that.

That's, that's gonna be the name by like
non-binary, like riot non-binary band.

Jeremy: Whos of the devil?

Emily: Whos of the devil Bishop.

Dead Bitch of the Knight.

Ciji: He literally hums,
he hums another man's leg.

Yeah.

He

didn't understand what he
was trying to communicate.

He was like, well, let me,
let me give you a visual.

Got it, man.

Ben: Oh man.

When he's trying to like, when
they're like, we don't believe

you, we don't need your expertise.

And then like he goes
like, look over there.

And then he goes and hides behind
another fucking like grave zone.

They're like, oh shit.

Look.

He went a short distance
without us noticing we bad help.

Emily: Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, I think it kind of.

You know, Lucy died and that is fucked up.

And I don't know if they found any
of the exploded blood or the do

or like, you know, like there's no
real discussion of the crime scene.

But you know, that's not, that's
distracting Will Graham wasn't

there, so, you know, well he

Ben: gets his little Sherlock
Holmes, like, you can't

prove vampires don't exist.

So how do you know it?

It's not a

Emily: vampire.

He's like, I hear, I hear a herd
of unicorns coming up the road

and it's absolutely unicorns.

And then everyone's like, I
thought you were a scientist.

And he's like, well there,
there's some fucking unicorns

right here, , who was right.

And they're like, well, I guess.

And they're looking and like, there's
some fucking unicorns right there.

Like they go find Lucy and she's
all caked up down there and

she shows up and is like, oh,

Ciji: with a kid.

And they're like, well shit, that is
a great, the way he shot that is, I

mean, it's all, it is just reversed, you
know, she times out and they reverse it.

But it, it, and it, it looks like
it's been reversed, but it works.

Yeah.

Because everything with Lucy is
now backwards of what we expect and

I that, that when she comes down
the stairs and the guy, I mean,

that whole scene is just, so what?

It's one of those scenes where I'm
just like this, this is cinema.

It is just, It's staged wonderfully.

She's, she's, and she just vomits blood.

It's just like, I know.

Oh,

Ben: I loved it.

Mm-hmm.

. She's

Ciji: got some ramy shit right there.

It's, it's so good and hilarious.

Yeah.

It doesn't take you out of it.

Ben: That's, I'm telling you, I'm telling
you co fucking loves the Evil dead movies.

You'll never convince me he doesn't.

Oh

Ciji: yeah.

Well, Sam Raymond.

Yeah.

And

Ben: they're movies.

How do you not love him?

Ciji: Don't forget

Emily: that our boy Dino Dees was involved
with those films and like, if there was

ever a movie that was Dino de Dentes
is Fuck Without Being De Dino Dees.

It's hard to say his name without,
there was a movie that was Dino without

Dino Fucking Ram Stokers Dracula.

Is it because that's some, some
fucking deal orant as shit right there.

Ciji: Like absolutely.

When you, when I,

Emily: we talk about Hannibal and
like how fu, how Hannibal the show is

just aesthetic and like extra as fuck.

This movie is like, you know, if
Hannibal's 11, this movie's 1100

and, but you know, this movie ran
so Hannibal could like walk in

a way that we could understand

Ciji: Absolutely.

Tea: Wearing a

Emily: tie.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Like this movie.

Fucking, yeah.

Ciji: That's why it feels like a very
professional student film because Yeah.

He's just doing, he's throwing
everything at this movie.

and it all magically works.

Even though, I mean an iris out and
an iris in like, how cheesy is that?

That's almost as bad as like Star
Wars, star white you know, wipes.

You're just like, what are we doing?

But it works because you know,
you got Dracula's eyes and it's

just like you found that effect
and you just lucked up, man.

But it works.

He really made it work.

And I dunno why this movie
isn't in the Smithsonian.

I've been to the Academy Museum, , no
mention of this movie at all.

Should

Ben: have all of Dracula
costumes in the Smithsonian.

We

Ciji: should, although some of them are
at the, and I'm like the Terminator,

like the academy and the, I'm like,
no, you need this ram strokes Dr.

And stuff from the cell too.

Just, just amazing stuff.

They should have

Ben: like the hat and the, the hat
and sunglass combo should be like on

display of like the Library of Congress.

Ciji: Absolutely.

Absolutely.

Like you said, the Twizzler's
Armor, I mean that alone

warrants, warrant should display.

I would pay $25 to do that in, in person.

Well, you can plus big same, you

Emily: could go to the winery
for free and it's there.

Ciji: The what?

The,

Emily: the Francis of

Ciji: Winery.

The winery.

Oh

Emily: yeah.

Up in hills.

It's Heal.

Yeah, it's it, I'm in Runner Park,
so like, oh, it's about, you know,

40 minutes off the freeway from us.

Ciji: Oh, well at least it's free.

I mean, that's mine.

That's.

Jeremy: Yeah, I drank some Francis
Ford Coppola of wine just to get

you know, acquainted with his work
coming up to this I never drink.

Okay.

It's very okay.

Walking.

Ciji: Why, what makes me sad, what makes
me sad about this movie in particular

is Universal really wanted this, I
don't know if you guys know that, that

Universal wanted this to be the beginning
of like a dark universe for them.

Mm-hmm.

, they, they were gonna have Daniel
Day Lewis Play The Mummy, and Oh yes.

Day Day Lewis playing, playing The Mummy.

And then I forget they wanted to
do a creature of the Black Lagoon.

They, they wanted to
do Van He and bring it.

It was gonna be like the mcu, it was gonna
be, we're gonna do Dracula, we're gonna

do the Mummy, we're gonna do Frankenstein
we're gonna do all these characters.

And it was gonna be one big movie where
Van Helsing would handle all of them.

And this was back in 92.

And the ACU really didn't come
together until like 99, 2000.

And I would've wanted to see that.

I mean, Daniel Day Lewis as the Mummy.

Tea: Yeah.

That would've been, I, I feel like,
I feel like there, there would be so

many, there would be so many method
acting stories about that situation.

, but yeah.

But I mean, it's, it's, you
know, it's building off the

original, you know, universal
monster movies where you did have.

You know, they didn't have quite as
many connections, but they definitely

tried to build those connections
between the characters and the movies.

And yeah, like that would've been,
that would've been super cool.

Ben: That would've been Stein Draco,
Daniel de Lewis', van Helsing.

Cuz again, like he would've
gotten so into it that he

would've just looked up headlines.

It would've been like, oh
no, he's hunting Bella Lago,

.
Ciji: But the the serious actor thing,
like we're gonna use, I mean, they

were kind of ahead of the curve,
but we're gonna get real actors to

do these silly characters and we're
gonna make it super serious, which

the MCU copied and stole from DC but
that's a whole other conversation.

But yes, I always

Ben: felt like with the shared
universe, the issue is how do you keep

the horror with that many characters?

Or if you go full superhero Avengers,
who do they then team up to fight?

Ciji: How do you

Tea: keep, I mean, Abbo
and Costello, obviously.

Yeah.

Emily: Right?

Yes, yes, that's true.

Ben: That's so, God, yes.

They should fight Costello.

How

Emily: do you keep consistency with Dr.

Ram Stokers Dracula in
a, in a series of films?

Like how do you keep
consistency with that style?

Ben: You can't.

No, you physically can't.

Ciji: Probably why it didn't happen.

You have to have co do them
all, which after this movie,

he was just like, I'm good.

It's

Jeremy: ing to me.

Cause I, I feel like Mary Shelly's
Frankenstein was a very deliberate

attempt to do the same sort of thing.

It's so different.

Like it's so

Ciji: I, no, I'm

Emily: thinking of Mary Wiley.

I

Ben: remember Mary

Jeremy: Riley.

Like, I really like Robert
Niro as the monster.

Yes.

That's really the saving
grace of that movie for me.

Is they really, they really do do the
thing where it's like, oh no, this is

more like the book than the universal
monster version of Frankenstein.

But also boy Kenneth is,

Tea: Oh, Ken Doll is is Ken Doll.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, it's one of those, I, and that's
one of the things that I find real, one of

the things that I find really interesting
about that movie in particular is that

it's a really, like if you, if you look
at that, Adaptation compared to the Jamie

Whale Classic, classic Frankenstein.

You've got something where it's
trying so hard to be so faithful to

the book, and yet it is not nearly as
good an adaptation as, as whale just

going super queer on the whole thing.

Emily: Right.

Ciji: I agree.

I agree.

Absolutely.

Look,

Emily: GUI del Toro finally
did a Shape of Water.

So we got the Creature
of the Black Lagoon.

Ciji: Yeah.

But there was no sex.

I mean, there was sex.

Maybe that's the,

Ben: but it wasn't like, is that you
just take all these monsters and you

just focus on making it all horny?

Emily: Yeah.

Cause Oh, Mary Riley, so the Mary
Riley was the one with John Melich.

Yeah,

Ciji: John

Emily: Melich.

Yes.

Julia Roberts was, Julia Roberts
was like the assistant or

the maid or something of Dr.

Je.

And so it had like this, this Dr.

Jekyll and Mr.

Hyde thing with John Melich, and it was
very much like the Dracula thing where

there was like this, this very like
dark, sexy romance and a lot of licking

nowhere near as good as Dracula, but
you know, John Malkovich almost sold it.

Ciji: But I think what you said
earlier holds true, like this period

was just a period of horny movies.

I mean, I looked up, I was thinking of
some other ones like fail attraction

disclosure all during this time.

And then we're not doing
the horny movie anymore.

You know what I mean?

And right.

Right around that time when that movie
came out, it was just like, we're,

we're just, nobody's, nobody's having
sex in movies for whatever reason.

Jeremy: Well, there's very little in the
way of r-rated blockbusters period now.

Like, true.

Emily: Well, all the sexiness is on tv.

Like all the, you know,
HBO's got all the sex.

I mean,

Ciji: in Lifetime you joke,
but Lifetime gets raunchy.

And I'm just like, I thought I
was watching about, you know, I

thought I was watching a movie
about the wrong babysitter, and

now you're just, what are we doing?

It's all soft core, these words.

It's a girl in her bra and the
guy is completely clothed and like

Emily: 40 years older than definitely

Tea: the wrong babysitter.

Emily: Absolutely.

Ben: It theses that was a genre that
thrived in the era before internet porn.

I don't know.

Tea: But I also think a lot of it,
I mean, a lot of it has to do with

international distribution too.

Like when we're talking about, when
we're talking about theatrical releases

that have to be acceptable in eight
zillion different international

markets or studios don't want them.

You know, I'm not, I I'm not necessarily
gonna be one of those people who's

like, oh yeah, and we're gonna blame
this on a country that has different

expectations of what movies are like.

Just make movies for different markets.

And they don't, they make one movie, they
try to sell it to every single market.

Absolutely.

So it really mm-hmm.

diminishes.

You know, not just, not just the
sexuality of our movies, but also a whole

bunch of different, you know, lines of
experimentation and topical and all kinds

of things that just don't happen in movies
anymore because studios want one movie

that they could sell in every single

Ciji: market.

Yeah.

And the, and the R-rated movies
are just slash our movies.

They're the R is for the Blood and the
gore, and sometimes language and, you

know, every now and then it's like, oh,
it's r because two, two people with the

same gender kiss we're not getting sex.

We've replaced it with violence, which
is fine, but it's just like Dracula.

This movie has both and both work
well and serve the plot and are

entertaining to watch and, you
know, we can get bloody and horny.

Emily: Yeah.

Well I think that that's the, the
fact that we have the, the bloody

and horny stuff on tv mm-hmm.

, is a testament to that.

Like the, the movie market be trying so
hard to be as accessible as possible to

all these different, like, global markets.

And that's another reason that
a lot of the more challenging

and interesting movies coming
in are from overseas, you know?

Absolutely.

Yep.

So that's a good point.

Yeah.

So we're actually, it's, it's, it's,
it's interesting and, you know, so many,

like one of my my recommendations for.

Was gonna be Vampire Hunter d Blood Lust,

Ciji: which takes

Emily: scenes like shot
for shot from this movie.

But they, like, they dial it up so far,
like they, the cast show, like really

bless them, bless them for it really
wanna be like on the blood lust level.

And it's really hard to do that
because it's Mad House at like, their

peak and Mad House actually made that
movie in English for a world market.

Yeah.

So that movie is, there's no Japanese
dub of that movie that is original.

It's like all, it's all in English.

And, but they, like, they take all of
the cool shit from Vampire, from a, from

Dracula, like the romance and everything,
and then add all like the cast shit.

So you have like a wolf guy with a wolf
mouth in his stomach and like a tree

chick and lasers and a fucking spaceship.

And you know, like this is this
movie that, that movie came out

in 2000, the, the blood list
wouldn't exist without this movie.

Mm-hmm.

. So, you know, we're now seeing like a
lot of that come back from movies like

this that are, that are you know, even
though they were sometimes like this, I

wouldn't say every decision in this movie
is successful in In Ramp Circus Dracula.

But there are

Ciji: so many decisions

Ben: though.

Yeah,

Tea: there were a lot, A lot of decisions.

It's

Jeremy: memorable.

There are more decisions per
minute in this movie than I

think any film I've ever seen.

And I think it's, other than like mad

Emily: why it works.

Like I think that's why it works when
the shit is so fucking goofy, is that

you're like, you know, it's not like
mad god goofy where you're like, okay,

well this plot is optional, you know?

Yeah.

Jeremy: Still something goofy and the
next minute you've forgotten about it.

Cause there's something else going on.

Like yeah,

Ben: this is the

Ciji: most movie.

Yeah.

I recall sitting there in the
theater a couple weeks ago

and thinking, is this bad?

Or is it good?

Like ? No, it was just you know,
when you, when you see a 30 year

old movie, like I recently for
the first time saw Casablanca.

Mm-hmm . And I've been trying
to go back and see all these old

buoys people like, oh it's amazing.

And some of 'em just like,
yes, it's actually amazing.

Other ones, I'm just like,
you just like it cuz it's old.

So I was looking at this, I was
sitting in the theater looking at

this movie and going, is this good?

I think this is good.

No, it's bad.

No, it's kinda corny.

Is it inventive?

Because every, like you said,
every 10 seconds there's a new

decision that makes you reevaluate
your evaluation in the movie.

And I don't know if that's on purpose
or accidental, but it all works.

Jeremy: There's some
stuff that I think works.

There's some things like the shots in
in the garden of the, like rainstorm

where the camera is just, it looks like
it's just swinging from a rope that I'm

just like, oh, fuck this, this is bad.

Actually, you know, some scenes where
they do some other equally crazy stuff and

I'm like, but actually no, I like that.

I think as with a lot of
movies that are campy bad and

good, just don't really apply.

Tea: Yeah.

I don't know that I would call it campy,
but I think that, but I think that I agree

with Jeremy in that like, it's a movie I,
I I would say aesthetic rather than campy.

Yes.

Um, aesthetic in the, like in
the, like Tumblr sense of the

word, where it is its own word.

You know the word, it's got vibes.

Exactly right.

So like you're watching this movie
that is aesthetic you know, and so

it's not so much about are we going
to qualify its goodness or badness.

It just is and we can
like it or dislike it.

Yes.

You, you judge

Ben: it by how much of a mood board it

Tea: is.

Yes, it's a mood board.

You're right.

Yes.

Emily: It's a mood

Ciji: board.

That's a great way to put it.

I just remember sitting there like, is
this one of those things that I remember

being good, but it's not, you know?

But you're right.

It's, it's just a mood

Emily: because when I was in high
school, I was obsessed with two

movies, this and Natural Born Killers.

Oh.

And that movie is a mood board and a
half that movie is the most aggressive

Pinterest board I've ever encountered.

Jeremy: The movie always kind of makes
me wish that Quent and Tarantino had

just kept writing and not directing.

Oh God yes.

There's some things he does so well, but
like that movie is lacking the smarm of

like Quentin Tarantino directed stuff.

And yeah, it works.

Like the writing works and I think there's
a lot of his movies that would work

better if he wasn't behind the camera.

Ciji: Smar is an excellent descriptor.

Absolutely.

I've never been able to put it into words.

I'm just like, there's something I
don't like about the way this guy.

Emily: his, uh, His movies
Stink of X Body spray,

.
Tea: It's, well, it's
like he's got his own gaze.

It's not exactly male gaze, which there is
a lot of male gazey stuff in some of his

movies, but it's not really male gazes.

It's just Quentin Gaze.

Yes.

Ciji: No, it's, it, he's looking,
it's like he's looking in a mirror

and it's like, I'm directing me and
you're like, there's other people that,

Jeremy: Yeah.

I feel like this is giving him too
much credit, but it's like Hitchcock.

Hitchcock just has like his stuff, and
if you want a Hitchcock movie, even

if you don't know it's a Hitchcock
movie, like a half an hour in, you're

like, oh, this is a Hitchcock movie.

Nevermind.

Like, with the possible exception
of Rebecca, which is like weird.

To be fair, it's weird in the cannon
of, his stuff, but like, he is so

aesthetic, like Yeah, Wock has his own
thing and the way that Tarantino has

his own thing and the way that David
Lynch has his own thing and like,

you can see the movie and be like,
oh, this is, this is definitely them.

Whereas I, I think the interesting
thing about this movie is

that it doesn't have co on it.

Yeah.

It's just, so Francis Ford
Coppola was like, fuck it.

I'm gonna make some wild shit that
people would never expect from me.

Emily: He took like, everything
he didn't do and then did.

Basically

Jeremy: cause Godfathers and
Godfather too, both are so

restrained and so precise and so

Ben: like, but then he
also made Apocalypse Now.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Ciji: But Apocalypse

Emily: Now still had, like, only
one scene happening at a time,

Jeremy: you know, apocalypse
Now is very serious.

Ben: How about when there's
three Winona Ryders all side

by side and the Triple Rider,

Emily: and then there's like a
Winona Ryder superimposed over a

mural of Winona Ryder that doesn't
quite look like Winona Ryder.

And so they have like,

Ben: Movie is so much fucking movie.

Ciji: And then, but I'm like,

Emily: movie.

You said it, I'll, I'll accept
it because at this point I don't

know what you're gonna do next.

And I'm

Ben: kind of afraid.

Jeremy: I feel like asking the usual
question that we ask at this point

of uh, would you recommend, this
just feels nonsensical at this point.

Cause I feel like we would all say, Even
if like, oh yeah, maybe it's absolutely,

maybe we're not sure if it's good or not.

It certainly is a lot.

Yeah.

Ciji: Is it feminist?

Emily: My answer is don't

Jeremy: I mean, good.

A good answer.

We talked about there being like this
emphasis on female sexuality, but

like, I would never categorize this
as being feminist despite, like Yeah.

It definitely being more
feminist than the book.

Ben: Yeah.

It, it definitely allows for women to
be horny, but in a very male gazey way.

Ciji: Absolutely.

Yes.

That's exactly what I was gonna say.

it's the way men think women are horny.

Yeah.

You know, it's, very much how men
think women think about sex, you know?

Yeah.

And, I don't know if you guys do
the betel test, but I was just like,

do they have a conversation about
something that does not involve a man?

And I don't think they

Emily: do.

Absolutely not.

Ciji: Unless you count them kissing.

But they don't speak.

So yeah, they have a

Emily: conversation that is
almost like, Hey, we like each,

you know, I love you very much.

I'm very sick and I've got garlic.

And, but it's, then it's
like you miss John Harker.

Oh.

You know,

Ben: they're constantly talking about sex.

Emily: Oh, yeah.

Tea: Yeah.

Does it count though, like, how do
you apply the Bechtel test when you

have two women who are talking about
men, where the subtext is that they're

really talking about each other?

I feel like

Emily: The subtext is too sub Yeah.

In this point

Tea: No, I mean, I, you know, and I don't
necessarily believe that the betel test

is good is your be all, end all of like,
is something feminist or not, but Right.

Is that like, okay, so we've got
this movie and you've got two

women who are only talking about
men, but we all know that's not

really what they're talking about.

And

Ciji: here's the thing, until you guys
started talking about how the subtext

was, they're really talking about women.

I'm like, oh, I didn't get that.

Like, it, it did not present itself to me.

But now since you've mentioned
it, I'm just like, Oh yeah.

That makes, I'm telling you,
I'm a late, I'm on a late.

No, no,

Tea: no.

It, but it's, it's also very much
like, I mean, and it's not the only

thing that's happening there, but
there are definitely points, I think

specifically with Lucy and Mina talking
about the like, oh, you know, Jonathan

really doesn't want me here like that.

She's not talking about Jonathan.

She's talking about Lucy.

Oh yeah.

Jeremy: In a weird way.

It has come back around to the original
subtext of the book being all about

how like he's describing men wanting
women, but what he is really talking

about is men wanting men and somehow has

Tea: converted.

That's definitely talking about
how much she's into Walt Whitman,

,
Ciji: Walt and

Emily: Cowboys.

That Mina is a protagonist in the book.

Like we have her diary in the book.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

. I think, I think that the fact that
we have her and then her talking

and like, and then Lucy, cause I
don't think Lucy has any sort of

self first person stuff in the

Ciji: book.

Jeremy: Oh.

She, I think it's, I get the real
impression that Lucy doesn't read much.

Emily: Well,

Ciji: no, I'm saying the pictures.

Ben: She's a doer, not a reader.

Jeremy: She does look at
the pictures in this movie.

If

Ciji: see diary, it's just something, her
mother, she writes things in her diary

cuz she knows her mother reads her diary.

So it's more like, I picked flowers
and I thought, I prayed and I

thought about how chased I am.

Yeah.

That, yeah.

Emily: Lucy is a, , a
good and virtuous woman.

Exactly.

Ciji: I never think

Emily: of sex.

Can we just say real quick, the quote that
Kean Reef says, and he's from his diary,

which I, I think is from the book when
he was uh, traveling to Romania on the

train and he says, in my journeys, I was
under the distinct impression that I was

leaving the west and going to the east.

He said that.

That's a quote.

That's a quote.

Now I know that these are like, what
they mean is like the big case of,

you know, uppercase Ws and the, but
like the way that it's delivered,

he's like, I traveled and I went
from one place to another and I am so

boring that I think that that's neat.

Ciji: Very much, very much.

Like, you know, I sat on a
plane and then we took home.

Yeah.

And the plane landed and
you're like, thank you.

Jeremy: I could see the people
below and they were very

Tea: small.

I had a distinctive impression that I
was flying from New York to Florida.

.
Ciji: But that's why I say Keanu's
acting accent aside, his acting is good.

Yeah.

that's har Harker is.

he's a hospital wall.

Yeah.

you know, it's there
cuz it's gotta be there.

But at the same time
it's, do you notice it?

It's,

Emily: it's generally dry, but only
wet when you don't want it to be

, . .
Jeremy: Oh God.

Okay.

That's as good as it place as
any uh, to say we have to get to.

Recommendations.

T did you have anything
you wanted to recommend

Tea: oh yeah, so I'm gonna say for
everybody who hasn't seen it, watched

the 1977 Dracula with Franklin, because
if you wanna talk about horny, I think

more from an audience perspective
than from a movie perspective, it's

definitely, definitely one to add
to your uh, Dracula I guess canon.

And then I think in the other absolute,
like, I feel like absolute necessity for

people who want to like see like all of
the different facets of Dracula in film.

Definitely see shadow of the vampire.

It's so good and it's such a good
like medit textual interpretation

of adaptations of Dracula.

And I won't say anymore
because it'll spoil it.

Jeremy: Absolutely.

Ciji, what would you recommend?

Ciji: I actually didn't, didn't
know about the recommendation

section, but I'm, I did think of

Ben: something.

It doesn't have to be DR.

Related.

Ciji: Well, first I was gonna say
hel sing the Hugh Jackman for good

laugh, but No, don't watch that.

It's awful.

Tea: When I saw that

Ciji: I walked, I actually saw
it three times in the theater

cuz I had a huge f my thing.

I'm that

Ben: ge you falling asleep means
you probably are enjoyed it

more than almost anyone else.

Yeah,

Ciji: probably.

, But I would say what we do in the shadows
season one, episode seven because it's

all about vampires and there's lots of
cameos and it's very enjoyable even if

you don't, I think it's episode seven.

Which one is that?

I could be, the three vampires get accused
of killing a very important vampire

and they convene the Vampire Council.

Yes.

And all these vampires
show up and it's just fun.

It's just a fun sort of
acknowledgement of the Vampire lo.

Yes.

And I think it's episode seven.

I will double check.

Emily: So Yeah.

Vampire Vampire Council.

Ciji: Yeah.

Vampire council episode.

It's, that's awesome.

That's my recommendation.

Nice.

Jeremy: Awesome.

Ben, what have you got to recommend?

Ben: Fuck it.

We talked about it enough.

Watch some like basic instinct.

Check out Fatal Attraction.

Just watch any of the, any of them.

Sharon Stone uh, erotic thrillers.

Just give them a watch.

Jeremy: I'll spoiled for you.

Fatal Attraction, not feminist . No,

Ben: not big surprise here.

.
Jeremy: Emily you, you had your, a
little bit of recommendation earlier.

What did you wanna recommend?

Emily: Well, cast Symphony of the Night is
always the best video game of this movie.

Also in, in a not Dracula related
territory the Guillermo del Toro Cabinet

of Curiosities series is so good.

Police watch it.

It, it has, yes, it's
every, has everything.

And you know, the, the episode seven
of that series is my favorite and

that's that's directed by Panos cuz
mottos, so, you know, I am biased,

and it also has Eric Andre in it.

The cabinet curiosities, it has all
sorts of different directors and it

is all hosted Twilight Zone style.

Jeremy: Okay, I have a couple things.

I mentioned Queer for Fear earlier.

I recommended that before,
but specifically they have an

episode that's largely about
Dracula and about Bram Stoker.

They also have a whole episode dedicated
to James Whale and his four horror films.

So those are definitely worth watching.

I there's, there's a lot of things
that I wanna recommend for this,

but in the spirit of recommending
something that people maybe haven't

checked out, we have talked before
on this show about our love for Star

Trek and specifically of Lower Decks.

For anybody who doesn't know, there is
a lower decks comic book now, which is

being written by Ryan North, made by Id
w and in the first arc of this he goes

immediately for the throat because they
get immediately into Holodeck drama

uh, make fun of Picard's PI program,
but eventually decide that they're

gonna try and uh, hit the same level.

Data and his Sherlock Homes
program by basically bringing

in Holodeck Dracula fantastic.

Ciji: Who publishes the lower decks?

Idw, I D w Ibw.

Okay.

Jeremy: Yeah, so I mean, if you've,
if you've read any Ryan North stuff

squirrel Girl or uh, any of his dinosaur
comics, many other things he does,

Tea: and you put that your own adventures,
which I don't remember what they're really

called, but his, his Shakespeare choose

Jeremy: Yeah.

Romeo and or Juliet.

And

Tea: to be, or Not To be,

Jeremy: yeah.

Both of which are great.

But, you know, specifically for this
group, I think the current arc of

lower decks, which features Holo
Dracula is particularly something

that everybody should check out.

I don't

Ciji: know if they're
making fun of Picard.

I don't know if I can,
I don't know if I can

Emily: cotton that , I
mean, the show Picard,

Ciji: I said Picard not the show.

.
Emily: That's, I mean, that's fair.

Jeremy: On that note actually, CijiI, why
don't you let people know where they can

uh, find you online if they want to uh,
follow, hang out, whatever, talk with you.

Don't

Ciji: find me online.

I'm good.

.
Ben: You know what?

I,

Ciji: I have opinions about things,
but I also work with children

so we don't cross the streams.

I'm on the show cuz I mean,
Jeremy, we go way, way back to

where Tumblr, yeah, I think so.

Tumblr or something, but I, I mean,
trying to, right now, yeah, you can

find me on Twitter at c the letter C.

The geek.

on Twitter and on Tumblr.

I am private so I might not
accept , your request unless I see

that you follow people I follow.

But yeah, don't find me on the internet.

I'm good.

,
Jeremy: Team, would you like me?

Sorry, you

Tea: anywhere on the internet?

. So I'm pretty much on every social
platform, including some that I didn't

know existed until like a week ago.

At Tea Berry Blue.

That's tea, like the drink berry,
like the fruit blue like the color.

Yeah, you can find me any of those
places and um, I don't know how much

I'm gonna be around because I'm gonna
be having a baby in two and a half

weeks, so if I get back, congrats.

Ben: Oh my God,

Tea: that's so exciting.

Or accept your request depending on what
the platform is like that will be why.

But yeah, you can generally
find me all those places.

Ben: Oh it seriously, so
much congrats to you and Jay.

Yeah, congrats.

Jeremy: Thank you.

Yeah, absolutely.

Well usually I run down everybody's
handles but I guess considering

the changes in where can be it's

Ben: mess.

It's a fire.

Ciji: Dumpster, make a

Emily: moth on Tumblr mega
underscore moth on Instagram

Ben: at Ben Theon on Twitter still.

And Hive I.

Jeremy: Yeah, and I'm uh, still
hanging around on what's left

of Twitter at j Room five eight.

I'm also that on Instagram.

For some reason, I've decided to become
Jeremy Whitley on both Tumblr and Hive.

So jeremy whitley.tumblr.com and Hive.

I'm just Jeremy Whitley.

And so you can, you can
come talk to me there.

Of course, progressively
Horrified is still itself.

You can follow us.

You can support us on Patreon
at Progressively horrified.

You can find us at our website,
progressively horrified do transistor.fm

and on Twitter, pro Horror Podd
where we'd love to hear from you.

And we would love for you to rate
this wherever you're listening to it

so that we can help us find new fans.

And thanks again to our, our
guests for joining us, c g t.

It was great to have you.

Ciji: Yes, thank you.

This was so much fun.

I'd love to come back if you know,
you didn't find me too annoying,

so, no, we would love to have you.

Ben: Thank you so much for coming on.

This

Ciji: was You're welcome.

I had a blast.

Tea: Yeah.

Super fun as always.

Thank you for letting me
come talk about Dracula.

Ben: Thank you for coming and talking,

Jeremy: DRAC.

Yes.

Yeah, it was great to have you guys andt.

By the time this comes out, you may
already have a baby, so congratulations.

Tea: Thank you.

Thank you.

They're welcome

Emily: on the show soon.

Ciji: Congratulations Health, and I
hope everything is healthy and painless.

Thank you so much.

Jeremy: I hope it goes well.

And thanks again to all
of you for listening.

Until next week, stay horrified.

al: Progressively horrified as
created by Jeremy wetland and

produced by Alicia Whitley.

This episode featured
Jeremy Ben, Emily T N C G.

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commentators are solely their own

and do not represent the intent or
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represent the employers, institutions,
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If you liked this episode, you can support
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Thanks for listening Bye.